Ron Spreeuwenberg

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[00:00] SPEAKER_02: It's Toronto's podcast on the Canada's podcast network.
[00:16] SPEAKER_00: Hi everyone and thanks for listening.
[00:19] SPEAKER_00: I'm Billy Bliss, a business degree and co-host of Toronto's Podcasts.
[00:23] SPEAKER_00: Part of the Canada's podcast network.
[00:25] SPEAKER_00: Your source for great insights from entrepreneurs across Canada.
[00:30] SPEAKER_00: Today I'd like to introduce you to Ron Spryunberg.
[00:34] SPEAKER_00: Since 2013, Ron has been the co-founder and CEO of HiMama,
[00:39] SPEAKER_00: based in Toronto, where he leads all aspects of the business
[00:43] SPEAKER_00: that facilitates information sharing between childcare programs and parents.
[00:49] SPEAKER_00: The HiMama application aims to save childcare and early learning programs
[00:53] SPEAKER_00: time and money while significantly enhancing family engagement
[00:57] SPEAKER_00: to real-time sharing of digital media.
[01:00] SPEAKER_00: Ron has an MBA from Harvard, specialising in international business and entrepreneurship
[01:05] SPEAKER_00: and a degree in engineering from the University of Waterloo.
[01:08] SPEAKER_00: I first met Ron when I was running an entrepreneurship program,
[01:12] SPEAKER_00: which he won.
[01:13] SPEAKER_00: That was about three years ago.
[01:14] SPEAKER_00: So Ron, why don't you give the audience a bit more on who you are
[01:18] SPEAKER_00: and your current business focus?
[01:21] SPEAKER_02: Sure, so thanks for having me on the show Philip.
[01:24] SPEAKER_02: I'm glad to connect with you again.
[01:26] SPEAKER_02: It has been three years, which is hard to believe.
[01:29] SPEAKER_02: So my background is mostly in consulting.
[01:33] SPEAKER_02: I spent about five years at the Lloyd Consulting in Toronto and Ottawa
[01:38] SPEAKER_02: and also spent a couple years over in London and UK
[01:41] SPEAKER_02: and worked in strategy and operations practices there.
[01:45] SPEAKER_02: I originally studied engineering at the University of Waterloo
[01:50] SPEAKER_02: and through my co-op internships there, I quickly realised that
[01:55] SPEAKER_02: I wanted to be more on the decision-making end of things in the company
[02:01] SPEAKER_02: and hence why I focused on business rules coming out of there
[02:05] SPEAKER_02: and working at Deloitte versus the execution side of things,
[02:08] SPEAKER_02: which I felt most engineers were doing and I felt they were
[02:12] SPEAKER_02: bringing a ton of value and weren't really compensated or respected
[02:16] SPEAKER_02: accordingly.
[02:18] SPEAKER_02: And so that's why I went more of the business route and in that process
[02:22] SPEAKER_02: I also went and did my MBA over business school and for me
[02:28] SPEAKER_02: that was very valuable because again I studied engineering and undergrad
[02:31] SPEAKER_02: so that really forced me to understand the fundamentals of business
[02:38] SPEAKER_02: and finance and economics through that degree as well.
[02:43] SPEAKER_02: Most recently I've been working on my startup called High Mama
[02:48] SPEAKER_02: so I started High Mama 2013 with my co-founder and CTO Alana
[02:54] SPEAKER_02: for OMEI, I'm the CEO and what High Mama is is an app for child care
[03:00] SPEAKER_02: and early learning programs and it's used by teachers to record
[03:05] SPEAKER_02: children's health, well-being, learning development in the classroom
[03:08] SPEAKER_02: and keep parents in the loop on what they're doing in daycare during the day
[03:13] SPEAKER_02: and the context I always give here is as a parent I'm dropping off my
[03:19] SPEAKER_02: child at daycare at eight or nine in the morning, I'm picking up up
[03:24] SPEAKER_02: between five and six and in most child care programs still today
[03:28] SPEAKER_02: I literally have no clue what's going on with my child during those
[03:33] SPEAKER_02: hours and in the meantime I've got my smartphone at my fingertips
[03:36] SPEAKER_02: with every other single piece of information you could possibly imagine
[03:40] SPEAKER_02: except for the information I care about most which is what's happening with my
[03:44] SPEAKER_02: child right now so that's High Mama and as I mentioned we're five years in
[03:49] SPEAKER_02: and we're a team of over 50 people now which is really exciting based here in Toronto
[03:54] SPEAKER_02: and continuing to grow and have fun in the process.
[03:57] SPEAKER_00: Great, that's super.
[03:59] SPEAKER_00: So you've explained to you did engineering but you really you
[04:03] SPEAKER_00: wanted to become an entrepreneur how long did it take to think about
[04:07] SPEAKER_00: actually from sort of thinking about becoming an entrepreneur to actually
[04:12] SPEAKER_00: getting started in it what took you to that to that starting line?
[04:18] SPEAKER_02: So it took a really long time.
[04:20] SPEAKER_02: It's something that really was on my mind for years before I really
[04:27] SPEAKER_02: dove in head first on it.
[04:30] SPEAKER_02: It started out at Waterloo so University of Waterloo for anyone that
[04:34] SPEAKER_02: doesn't know too much about it.
[04:36] SPEAKER_02: It is a very entrepreneurial university in Canada.
[04:41] SPEAKER_02: There are quite a few startups coming out of there.
[04:44] SPEAKER_02: It's very practical oriented so again a lot of engineers are graduating
[04:49] SPEAKER_02: from there and of course engineers like to create and do tangible things
[04:55] SPEAKER_02: and you know you had rim blackberry coming out of there with
[04:59] SPEAKER_02: Lazaridas being a very big supporter of the University of Waterloo.
[05:04] SPEAKER_02: And so there was kind of like this this entrepreneurial vibe at the school
[05:08] SPEAKER_02: which was kind of what started getting me thinking a little bit more
[05:12] SPEAKER_02: seriously about entrepreneurship and what really influenced me
[05:17] SPEAKER_02: probably the most though was a good friend of mine.
[05:22] SPEAKER_02: He had a brother who was like the stereotypical entrepreneur.
[05:28] SPEAKER_02: He started an advertising business and he was making these pitches
[05:33] SPEAKER_02: to like really big companies when he had literally no employees and no other
[05:38] SPEAKER_02: customers and he was pitching them off a product and he was selling it.
[05:42] SPEAKER_02: And he would tell me these crazy stories about his brother and all
[05:46] SPEAKER_02: entrepreneurial war stories he had with the ups and downs.
[05:51] SPEAKER_02: And you know it got me really excited about the possibility and
[05:55] SPEAKER_02: really you know it emphasized to me how a single person can go from
[06:01] SPEAKER_02: nothing to you know a multi-million dollar business just with the tenacity
[06:07] SPEAKER_02: and persistence of themselves.
[06:10] SPEAKER_02: And so that was really exciting to me and I think really what
[06:13] SPEAKER_02: taught that idea of entrepreneurship embedded in my mind.
[06:19] SPEAKER_02: That said I also was quite I'm quite pragmatic.
[06:24] SPEAKER_02: I grew up in a Dutch family and that Dutch tend to be a little bit
[06:28] SPEAKER_02: more in the pragmatic side and my family generally wasn't super entrepreneurial
[06:33] SPEAKER_02: frankly.
[06:34] SPEAKER_02: You know we grew up they grew up I should say in an age where you know
[06:39] SPEAKER_02: you get a job and you stick to your job for 30 years through to retirement
[06:43] SPEAKER_02: and you know you're good to go sort of thing and so that's how I was raised.
[06:48] SPEAKER_02: So for me I think certainly that had an influence on me needing sort of a
[06:54] SPEAKER_02: few years for that to really really think upon the entrepreneurship
[07:00] SPEAKER_02: side and you know diving into it.
[07:03] SPEAKER_02: And so that that that's where I made the transition into Deloitte and
[07:07] SPEAKER_02: you know certainly in some ways consulting is quite entrepreneurial as well.
[07:11] SPEAKER_02: You know you like like you're leading projects on your own oftentimes with little support.
[07:17] SPEAKER_02: It's not very hierarchical and you're kind of like selling yourself internally and
[07:22] SPEAKER_02: externally all the time and so you know good experience there for sure.
[07:27] SPEAKER_02: And you know I kind of hit the point which which some people do in consulting
[07:31] SPEAKER_02: where especially when you're sort of around the manager level and it's you know
[07:35] SPEAKER_02: you got to make a decision.
[07:36] SPEAKER_02: Am I am I going the partner route and making this my career or am I getting out
[07:42] SPEAKER_02: and doing something else and you know for me that's kind of when I really came
[07:48] SPEAKER_02: back to the entrepreneurship question and said am I going to do this because
[07:53] SPEAKER_02: it's now or never.
[07:55] SPEAKER_02: I had a little bit of a situation in my life where I had an opportune time to do it
[08:02] SPEAKER_02: in that I mentioned earlier I spent a couple years with Deloitte over in the UK
[08:07] SPEAKER_02: and that was actually on the sacrament so it was a set period of time with an end date.
[08:13] SPEAKER_02: And so it worked out well because that end date of the sacrament created a really natural
[08:19] SPEAKER_02: opportunity for me to reflect and say okay I'm going to go back to the Toronto Deloitte
[08:25] SPEAKER_02: office like is this what I'm doing or not you know what I mean.
[08:28] SPEAKER_02: And so and it was great because from the perspective of the Deloitte office in the UK
[08:34] SPEAKER_02: they weren't going to miss me because they knew I had that end date.
[08:37] SPEAKER_02: They were planning around that and in Toronto and here in Canada they you know
[08:42] SPEAKER_02: I hadn't been here for a couple years so they also weren't necessarily I wasn't
[08:46] SPEAKER_02: like they were losing anybody from their perspective so you know I felt good about
[08:51] SPEAKER_02: not not leaving my consulting firm in the desk with the decision and I said you know
[08:56] SPEAKER_02: it's now or never and I actually did what I don't really recommend anyone quite frankly
[09:00] SPEAKER_02: but I left Deloitte at that juncture without having anything lined up.
[09:06] SPEAKER_02: So I was actually just speaking to yeah just speaking to different people in my
[09:10] SPEAKER_02: network to see what they were up to and talking about and thinking about different entrepreneurial
[09:14] SPEAKER_02: ideas but I actually had nothing lined up at the time and you know of course
[09:20] SPEAKER_02: not having a job and making no money does certainly force you to come to a
[09:27] SPEAKER_02: decision or to action items quickly and to get there.
[09:34] SPEAKER_00: So I mean why hi mama how did you focus on that?
[09:38] SPEAKER_00: Well what brought you to that business in particular?
[09:42] SPEAKER_02: Yeah so I think it's a really good example of what I think is super duper important
[09:48] SPEAKER_02: if you're an entrepreneur and you want to start a business which is just start doing
[09:53] SPEAKER_02: because you don't know you know what the end result is going to be and so for me
[09:58] SPEAKER_02: in Alana we ended up building hi mama in the very earliest days as basically a
[10:06] SPEAKER_02: competitor to Facebook so if you're a parent with young kids instead of posting your
[10:10] SPEAKER_02: photos on Facebook to you know let's say you're 500 Facebook friends including
[10:14] SPEAKER_02: people you haven't seen since high school 10 years ago it would just be a very
[10:19] SPEAKER_02: close network of family and friends and so you would also be incentive
[10:23] SPEAKER_02: I'd just share more photos and memories and stories of your kids because of
[10:28] SPEAKER_02: course like the grandparents and aunts and uncles are going to want to get as much of that
[10:32] SPEAKER_02: stuff as possible and so that was kind of the original idea.
[10:36] SPEAKER_02: We worked on that for called about three to six months and we created the app we
[10:41] SPEAKER_02: got some folks on it and did some beta testing. What we quickly realized was two
[10:47] SPEAKER_02: things one is consumers are very fickle with their apps so you know while you could
[10:54] SPEAKER_02: get people to download your app and use it it's very hard to have those users
[10:59] SPEAKER_02: engaged and activated on your product over time and the second thing is
[11:05] SPEAKER_02: monetization in B2C or selling to consumers is also very difficult and often
[11:11] SPEAKER_02: requires raising a whole bunch of money and your success rate is likely quite
[11:16] SPEAKER_02: low and so you know you've got the candy crushes of the world out there but for
[11:22] SPEAKER_02: every candy crush there's thousands of other apps that you know go to zero pretty
[11:27] SPEAKER_02: quickly and so we were thinking you know how can we take what we've already
[11:32] SPEAKER_02: done and leverage that to create a viable and sustainable business.
[11:39] SPEAKER_02: So we started talking to some of our network around you know what we had created
[11:44] SPEAKER_02: and a friend of ours he had a son who was a toddler at the time and day care
[11:51] SPEAKER_02: and he was telling us about his experience and how every day he got a handwritten
[11:55] SPEAKER_02: note that he would take home when he picked up his child at the end of the day
[12:00] SPEAKER_02: and it would say you know what Adam had for his meals and when he had his
[12:06] SPEAKER_02: nap time and what activities he worked on but he was like you know half the
[12:10] SPEAKER_02: time I can't even read it because the teacher is writing like ten of these for
[12:14] SPEAKER_02: every kid so they're writing super fast and so like not legible and it's not very
[12:18] SPEAKER_02: useful frankly the information they put on there it's not engaging it's just like
[12:22] SPEAKER_02: handwritten notes and so that really that's really when the light bulb went
[12:26] SPEAKER_02: off and we realized if we created a software product for the day care that would be
[12:32] SPEAKER_02: very interesting because first of all we can connect it and leverage this existing
[12:38] SPEAKER_02: parent app that we've created which creates a communication channel between the day care
[12:42] SPEAKER_02: and the parent secondly the day care is incentivized to add information into the
[12:47] SPEAKER_02: software because they want to keep the parents update as a service to their
[12:51] SPEAKER_02: customers to keep them informed on how their kids are doing the parents are going to
[12:55] SPEAKER_02: be logging in and very engaged in the product because they're going to want to see
[13:00] SPEAKER_02: and get those updates which we're certainly seeing from our end and lastly we
[13:04] SPEAKER_02: have a real tangible B2B buyer with the child care owner operator subscribing to this
[13:14] SPEAKER_02: software product and so we feel like we have all the key elements of what we need is
[13:20] SPEAKER_02: to create a successful and viable business for the long term.
[13:23] SPEAKER_00: So from sort of founding high mama to that point I mean how long did that focus
[13:30] SPEAKER_00: take to get it from the beginning to where you had your model you know you
[13:36] SPEAKER_00: could move forward basically.
[13:38] SPEAKER_02: It took probably about a year so we yeah so like let's say in the fall of
[13:45] SPEAKER_02: 2012 we had started creating this B2C Facebook like app and we did that
[13:55] SPEAKER_02: through to March of the following year so basically spend like half a year
[14:02] SPEAKER_02: kind of like part time-ish like nobody was full time on it but we're moving that
[14:07] SPEAKER_02: forward and then in April of 2013 that's when we went full steam ahead
[14:15] SPEAKER_02: on this child care product idea and we released that in October so we kind of
[14:21] SPEAKER_02: spent call it six months on that initial B2C product part time and then another
[14:25] SPEAKER_02: six months months designing developing the child care product.
[14:30] SPEAKER_00: So did you need financing to get things rolling I mean how did you get that was
[14:35] SPEAKER_00: just curious.
[14:37] SPEAKER_02: We were super duper bootstrapped so we basically made no money for that year
[14:44] SPEAKER_02: we a couple of our founding partners kind of put in a little bit of money just
[14:49] SPEAKER_02: to like keep the lights on sort of thing and enough so that we could pay the bills
[14:54] SPEAKER_02: kind of thing but that's it really we ran super duper lean and it what we could
[15:02] SPEAKER_02: with what we had.
[15:03] SPEAKER_00: So where are you I mean where are you today are you calling making money you know
[15:08] SPEAKER_00: how long did it take you to get profitable.
[15:11] SPEAKER_02: Yeah so I mean that's a dial you know as a SaaS business that you have to you
[15:17] SPEAKER_02: know you can turn up or down right so we you know for us like we we can and have
[15:23] SPEAKER_02: been and will be profitable but we also you know profitability is at the
[15:28] SPEAKER_02: sacrifice of growth right so we're always trying to find that bright mix and
[15:32] SPEAKER_02: sometimes it changes and so we're always looking at that you know we could be you
[15:38] SPEAKER_02: know we could be profitable three months after launching the product we could be
[15:43] SPEAKER_02: profitable 12 months 24 months 36 but we're always questioning are we investing
[15:49] SPEAKER_02: enough as well we do have competitors out there but we we go in waves and
[15:56] SPEAKER_02: certainly in the last five years we've been profitable at times and then once
[16:02] SPEAKER_02: and then once we hit that profitability then we decide to read the best moment in
[16:08] SPEAKER_00: your work burn cash. So let's move away from the business let's move to
[16:12] SPEAKER_00: Ron what does this typical day look like for you how do you maintain the kind of
[16:17] SPEAKER_00: focus you know if it needs to succeed and to have fun.
[16:21] SPEAKER_02: Yeah so I mean certainly it changes a lot over time and for me that's one of
[16:27] SPEAKER_02: the most exciting things about being a co-founder of a startup is that your job
[16:33] SPEAKER_02: description changes I would say every six months my job is completely different than
[16:38] SPEAKER_02: what it was six months before and it's awesome because I'm always challenged I'm always
[16:42] SPEAKER_02: doing new things right so you know and I think that's part of what makes an
[16:46] SPEAKER_02: entrepreneur an entrepreneur though too right is that they have that flexibility
[16:50] SPEAKER_02: to do that so like when I first started high-mom I was literally driving around
[16:56] SPEAKER_02: in a Toyota matrix with a high-mom magnet on the side of it going to talk
[17:00] SPEAKER_02: care programs and interviewing people to learn about what the heck they do all
[17:04] SPEAKER_02: day and what their problems were and how we could help them. I spent a few months
[17:09] SPEAKER_02: doing that and that was when it was just me and my co-founder and but today of
[17:15] SPEAKER_02: course my life is quite different with a team of 50 people and so I lean very
[17:19] SPEAKER_02: heavily on my leadership team across the different functions in the company to
[17:24] SPEAKER_02: to lead their teams and I'm really just here to support them so that's one of my
[17:29] SPEAKER_02: big roles. The second one is you know the vision and leadership for the company
[17:35] SPEAKER_02: certainly has become more and more important and relevant to me as the company
[17:39] SPEAKER_02: grows to keep that that North star and the third is that you know I have to
[17:47] SPEAKER_02: at the highest level manage those strategic decisions like we were talking about
[17:52] SPEAKER_02: before I'm like profitability versus growth and how we finance the business to
[17:58] SPEAKER_02: maintain that right balance and also no matter what stage you're at in your company
[18:06] SPEAKER_02: customers are always super important so I always ensure that I get in front of
[18:10] SPEAKER_02: customers at all points of the customer lifecycle pre-sale and post-sale for
[18:18] SPEAKER_00: example. When I met you you were sort of intranu in Canada are you still
[18:24] SPEAKER_00: focused on Canada or are you doing business elsewhere? No so we do most of
[18:31] SPEAKER_02: our business in Canada and the US and we actually do have a pretty strong customer
[18:39] SPEAKER_02: base internationally too. So sort of like pockets around the world where we're
[18:43] SPEAKER_02: getting you know getting some traction and we haven't really done that proactively
[18:47] SPEAKER_02: it's just happened more organically but certainly getting some traction there
[18:52] SPEAKER_02: but mostly Canada and the US and the whole team is based in Toronto. What are the
[18:57] SPEAKER_00: biggest benefits for you about being an entrepreneur in the GTA? You know why
[19:03] SPEAKER_02: Toronto? Why here? I think one of the biggest benefits of Toronto is the people
[19:10] SPEAKER_02: and of course if you're creating a business at the end of the day it's all about
[19:15] SPEAKER_02: the people you know that's both on the talent side you've got a lot of talented
[19:19] SPEAKER_02: people in Toronto. There's some good university and college programs you know
[19:24] SPEAKER_02: from the University of Waterloo through to the University of Toronto and all the
[19:28] SPEAKER_02: other wonderful schools in and around here and you know people of course as
[19:32] SPEAKER_02: anybody knows in Ontario a lot of folks tend to come to the GTA area after
[19:40] SPEAKER_02: graduating because there is a lot of career opportunities here and so you've got
[19:44] SPEAKER_02: a lot of talented people but also just culture too right so it's the right mix
[19:48] SPEAKER_02: of talented people but also talented people where you can have a friendly
[19:55] SPEAKER_02: culture in a team of authentic and genuine people which is something that I
[20:01] SPEAKER_02: care very deeply about is that we create a business that is successful
[20:06] SPEAKER_02: economically and commercially but also from a social perspective in terms of
[20:13] SPEAKER_02: social impact and that's both you know for customers and community as well as
[20:17] SPEAKER_00: our team here in Toronto. Just staying local you know we do some of our best
[20:22] SPEAKER_00: work outside of the office. Is there a place in Toronto or close to Toronto
[20:26] SPEAKER_00: where you like to recharge you know get inspired maybe just even think get away and
[20:31] SPEAKER_02: think. Yeah I wish I had so much time to do that.
[20:41] SPEAKER_02: Well so my wife and I were both from Zoch western Ontario and she grew up
[20:46] SPEAKER_02: on a farm down there so oftentimes we'll go down that way you know for a weekend or
[20:50] SPEAKER_02: a few days just to get out of the city which is quite nice you know there's
[20:55] SPEAKER_02: certainly the element of the hustle and bustle in a city like Toronto which is
[20:59] SPEAKER_02: great like it creates you know that buzz that you need to keep going but also I
[21:05] SPEAKER_02: think it can distract you from taking a step back and reflecting and it doesn't
[21:10] SPEAKER_02: really allow for that very easily so kind of getting out of the hustle bustle
[21:15] SPEAKER_02: in the city I do find helps helps with that. Do you think entrepreneurs have to be
[21:21] SPEAKER_00: weird you're unique? Why are differently? I mean you know you're a guy you know
[21:26] SPEAKER_00: Waddleau engineer the MBA Harvard top five consulting you know why the heck did
[21:34] SPEAKER_02: you bother becoming an entrepreneur you know. So I mean to answer your first question
[21:40] SPEAKER_02: I think no you have to be you don't have to be too weird or too different like it's
[21:46] SPEAKER_02: hard to it's hard to like generalize entrepreneurs every entrepreneur is very
[21:51] SPEAKER_02: different and I've seen you know a little bit more crazy super creative maybe very
[21:58] SPEAKER_02: technical kind of entrepreneur who's going to like create this amazing innovative
[22:05] SPEAKER_02: new product for example and then that product in their mind basically is what
[22:12] SPEAKER_02: creates an amazing business but you also see entrepreneurs on the opposite end of
[22:16] SPEAKER_02: that spectrum who are operators or you know very strong managers or leaders
[22:22] SPEAKER_02: who understand business very well and then create like a product their engineering
[22:27] SPEAKER_02: team around them and you've got everything in between so you know there's
[22:33] SPEAKER_02: certainly different types of entrepreneurs and certain entrepreneurs take more
[22:38] SPEAKER_02: less risk too right so it's really what you're comfortable with and so I don't
[22:43] SPEAKER_02: think there's any sort of queer definition there. I must admit most entrepreneurs
[22:47] SPEAKER_00: that I seem to know are actually kind of low-risk people it's kind of weird but
[22:52] SPEAKER_00: man you know what kind of job would you not like to do you know you you settled
[22:57] SPEAKER_00: on building a business I mean you know you have a profession which is really
[23:02] SPEAKER_00: a you know engineering consulting what wouldn't you want to do.
[23:07] SPEAKER_02: I mean it kind of goes back a little bit to your question too of like well you
[23:10] SPEAKER_02: know why do you want to know why be an entrepreneur why start a business.
[23:16] SPEAKER_02: It's the classic thing right like once you are an entrepreneur and you start a
[23:20] SPEAKER_02: business it's very hard to envision going back to anything else quite frankly
[23:26] SPEAKER_02: and I think for me like you know it's a lot of things but I think mostly what
[23:33] SPEAKER_02: it comes down to for me is I want to optimize my impact and I want to do the
[23:44] SPEAKER_02: things that I feel are really important and have you know my impact on the
[23:50] SPEAKER_02: world and I can't do that unless I can make my own decision so like you know a
[23:54] SPEAKER_02: good example is and I touched on this briefly but I believe very strongly that
[23:59] SPEAKER_02: having a strong social purpose and social vision is highly correlated to
[24:06] SPEAKER_02: creating a great business and there's not enough companies out there doing that
[24:11] SPEAKER_02: right now and so for me it was very important that we became a certified
[24:16] SPEAKER_02: B corporation or benefit corporation to solidify our position on that and so
[24:21] SPEAKER_02: for me you know I really admire entrepreneurs who are living that and a big
[24:29] SPEAKER_02: challenge is that you know and this is part of you know an ongoing you know
[24:35] SPEAKER_02: list of literature out there about startups and especially in the valley like
[24:40] SPEAKER_02: everyone saying they're doing great things but are they you know when you dig
[24:44] SPEAKER_02: deeper you have the types of things that we're reading in the news about
[24:50] SPEAKER_02: Facebook and you know what they're doing with their data there's something I read
[24:56] SPEAKER_02: just this morning with Elon Musk and Tesla and you know certainly there's
[25:03] SPEAKER_02: entrepreneurs that are there aiming to do big things and change the world but
[25:08] SPEAKER_02: also you know as you grow and create a big company you know your ethics and
[25:13] SPEAKER_02: what you prioritize can change and so I think you always have to stay grounded
[25:18] SPEAKER_02: in what's important and so for me you know that's something that's really
[25:21] SPEAKER_02: important and and something that I wanted to be able to do and I would I thought
[25:25] SPEAKER_02: I wouldn't be able to do that if I was working for somebody else kind of following
[25:31] SPEAKER_00: on that what is your favorite word or quote whatever that you like to use and
[25:37] SPEAKER_00: the corollary what is your least favorite word or sentence you don't want to
[25:42] SPEAKER_02: hear well start with my start with my least favorite thing which is the word
[25:47] SPEAKER_02: revolutionize any any anytime I see a business a startup saying they're
[25:54] SPEAKER_02: going to revolutionize something you know it's it's kind of a turnoff
[25:59] SPEAKER_02: because you know frankly if I'm being honest nobody's revolutionizing
[26:03] SPEAKER_02: anything everybody's making incremental improvements the world which is great
[26:08] SPEAKER_02: but let's not pretend like we're revolutionizing anything so that's the
[26:14] SPEAKER_02: one that I like the least what you know what quote do I like the most oh that's a
[26:20] SPEAKER_02: tough question there is a quote by by Churchill and I don't know exactly how it
[26:25] SPEAKER_02: goes but it's something along the lines of and certainly this is the spirit of it
[26:32] SPEAKER_02: is you know if you fall on your face trying that is a better outcome than never
[26:39] SPEAKER_02: trying it all and and certainly that's that's a powerful motto and
[26:45] SPEAKER_02: message and and you know something that was encouraging to me to take the
[26:50] SPEAKER_02: leap into entrepreneurship is I didn't want to have regret I didn't want to you
[26:55] SPEAKER_02: know I didn't want to be at retirement and think to myself you know I wish
[27:00] SPEAKER_02: it when I was you know whenever in my 20s my 30s my 40s I wish I
[27:05] SPEAKER_02: would have made that decision to start my own business I wonder what have
[27:09] SPEAKER_02: happened if I never wanted to have that conversation with myself I would
[27:14] SPEAKER_02: rather give it a go and see what happens and if I fall in my face and fell
[27:18] SPEAKER_02: so be it but at least I know I tried and then keep you up at night in
[27:22] SPEAKER_02: particular to be honest no I you know we're the a startup is it is a
[27:29] SPEAKER_02: marathon and it's not a sprint and so you know we always try to keep that in
[27:33] SPEAKER_02: mind I'm on like we don't encourage people to be pulling all nighters and be
[27:38] SPEAKER_02: super stressed about what they have in the job and frankly if people are then
[27:42] SPEAKER_02: we're like I'm not doing my job as a leader and if I'm super stressed then I'm
[27:46] SPEAKER_02: you know I'm doing something wrong too so I actually really respect those
[27:50] SPEAKER_02: leaders out in the world people that have crazy jobs CEO's a multi-billion
[27:55] SPEAKER_02: dollar companies who work nine to five and they go home to their families and
[27:58] SPEAKER_02: there's a really good you know interview the other day I saw with Lauren Buffett
[28:02] SPEAKER_02: and like you look at his calendar and he's got he's hardly any meetings
[28:05] SPEAKER_02: because he knows that it manages time I focus is on what's important and I actually
[28:10] SPEAKER_02: respect that.
[28:12] SPEAKER_00: Me too so that's have a little bit of fun here there's a small tropical island just
[28:18] SPEAKER_00: off Fiji that is only one phone booth and no internet we draw a few off there
[28:23] SPEAKER_00: and you won't have a computer a smartphone or tablet anything like that you
[28:28] SPEAKER_00: can use the phone booth located there anytime to call the boat and we'll come
[28:31] SPEAKER_00: back and pick you up how long would you last before you made that call and
[28:36] SPEAKER_00: what would you do there while you were there?
[28:39] SPEAKER_02: How big is the island?
[28:41] SPEAKER_00: It's a small tropical island so it's not.
[28:45] SPEAKER_00: It ain't Fiji it's off of BG okay.
[28:49] SPEAKER_02: I'm just wondering how much exploring I can do because I like exploring I'm
[28:54] SPEAKER_02: pretty adventurous so you know if there's an opportunity to explore I could see
[28:59] SPEAKER_02: myself staying quite about longer but if it's super small then I'm not sure.
[29:05] SPEAKER_02: The short answer is not very long.
[29:10] SPEAKER_02: I think maybe like maybe like three or four days maybe I would relax for
[29:15] SPEAKER_02: three or four days and say hey this is great and then I'd probably be out.
[29:21] SPEAKER_00: How can a list of get hold of you and there's anything you'd like to add
[29:25] SPEAKER_00: before you know we call it a day?
[29:28] SPEAKER_02: Yeah best way to get a hold of me is my email it's run at highmama.com R-O-N
[29:33] SPEAKER_02: at highmama h-i-m-a-m-a.com
[29:37] SPEAKER_00: Well Ron it's been great meeting up again and glad to hear that highmama is
[29:44] SPEAKER_00: doing so well especially as we put it back three years ago as being a winner
[29:48] SPEAKER_02: which is terrific. Thanks for having me so.
[29:51] SPEAKER_00: Thanks everyone for taking the time today to listen to Dronders podcast on the
[29:55] SPEAKER_00: Canada's podcast network. We hope you enjoyed the podcast today.
[30:00] SPEAKER_00: Make sure you sign up for our newsletters or write a review for us on iTunes.
[30:05] SPEAKER_00: You can connect with us on Twitter, Facebook, Instagram, LinkedIn or at Canada's podcast.com.
[30:11] SPEAKER_00: In order to check out what other entrepreneurs are doing across the country
[30:15] SPEAKER_00: I'm Goldless, see you next time.