Rob Townsend is Founder and CEO of Camber, a Fintech and Wealth Management Company in Calgary

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[00:00] SPEAKER_01: Welcome to Canada's podcast, the number one podcast for entrepreneurs by
[00:06] SPEAKER_01: entrepreneurs. Hello and welcome to Calgary's podcast on Canada's podcast
[00:12] SPEAKER_01: network. I'm your host Mario Toneguzi joining me today as Rob Townsend who is
[00:17] SPEAKER_01: the founder and CEO of Camber, a FinTech and wealth management company in
[00:23] SPEAKER_01: Calgary. Thanks for joining us today Rob. I really thank you for having me.
[00:27] SPEAKER_01: Okay let's start off with just asking you what is Camber? What do you guys do?
[00:32] SPEAKER_00: Camber is an independent financial advisor and we really have the goal of helping people
[00:39] SPEAKER_00: be lower their fees when it comes to investment management, increase the
[00:43] SPEAKER_00: probability of their investment strategies and help them make data-driven
[00:47] SPEAKER_00: decisions with their life savings. Hey where did you guys start? We launched
[00:52] SPEAKER_00: our firm in November or sorry March 2019. Okay then and can you give me a
[00:59] SPEAKER_01: little bit of the background of you know why you decided to launch this
[01:03] SPEAKER_00: company? Yeah definitely. I mean I'm kind of I'm sitting in our
[01:08] SPEAKER_00: our boardroom which is kind of paints a picture of why this firm exists and
[01:13] SPEAKER_00: our boardroom which can't see too much right now but it really looks much
[01:17] SPEAKER_00: more like a living room and we did that purposely because at the other firms
[01:21] SPEAKER_00: that I've been at our client meeting rooms were always very traditional you
[01:25] SPEAKER_00: know big oak boardrooms and kind of an intimidating
[01:30] SPEAKER_00: feel and I don't think that was done on purpose but I think it just shows that
[01:34] SPEAKER_00: the industry really hasn't thought that much about the client experience and
[01:38] SPEAKER_00: when you're meeting with people as a financial advisor you're talking to
[01:41] SPEAKER_00: them about you know their fears and their dreams and what do they want to do
[01:45] SPEAKER_00: with their life and how much do you want to leave to your children and
[01:48] SPEAKER_00: these are big questions and they need to be in an environment where it
[01:53] SPEAKER_00: invokes that kind of ability to have those conversations to be vulnerable
[01:57] SPEAKER_00: and also I think as financial advisors we're all guilty of talking very
[02:01] SPEAKER_00: jargon heavy and people have to be able to you know put up their hand and say
[02:05] SPEAKER_00: I don't understand and I think in a room like this invokes and invites those
[02:11] SPEAKER_00: conversations more naturally and it's just kind of a lens of
[02:17] SPEAKER_00: showing kind of how we think about this business and how we're trying to be
[02:20] SPEAKER_00: a little bit different and really do that by thinking about
[02:24] SPEAKER_00: what is the client feeling going through and can we enhance that experience?
[02:28] SPEAKER_00: Now I'm curious about the name where has that come from what does it mean?
[02:33] SPEAKER_00: So Canberra is a it's a mathematical angle that's used in automotive
[02:38] SPEAKER_00: design, sailboat, skis and snowboards and it increases performance and
[02:43] SPEAKER_00: and I think when it comes to automotive design it's specifically interesting the
[02:47] SPEAKER_00: Canberra is the tilt of the wheels and that used to be done by a
[02:53] SPEAKER_00: a touch and feel of a real car person they're intuitive touch
[02:57] SPEAKER_00: well what they found is with computers they can dial that into a much
[03:01] SPEAKER_00: greater degree and really increase that vehicle's
[03:04] SPEAKER_00: efficiency and performance so that is a lot of analogies to our story which is
[03:08] SPEAKER_00: what we're trying to do a lot of the investment industry is about
[03:11] SPEAKER_00: intuition and gut and feel and we're saying you know in an age of data when it
[03:17] SPEAKER_00: comes to your life savings maybe we should be harnessing the power of data and
[03:21] SPEAKER_00: bringing what's being used in the biggest most successful companies in the
[03:25] SPEAKER_00: world and bringing that to your own personal
[03:27] SPEAKER_00: financial situation and hopefully applying that Canberra angle which again is
[03:32] SPEAKER_00: increasing the efficiency and performance of the overall portfolios and the
[03:36] SPEAKER_00: investment strategy that we put in place for points.
[03:38] SPEAKER_01: Okay, since the the inception how have you found business obviously you know
[03:44] SPEAKER_01: you know one year you started one year before everything went crazy in the
[03:50] SPEAKER_01: world so how has that business been in that
[03:54] SPEAKER_00: your time for you? Yeah definitely none of the tailwinds that we were hoping for
[04:00] SPEAKER_00: from a macro perspective have shown up but that's okay it only makes you
[04:04] SPEAKER_00: stronger and I feel like every you know every business owner that you
[04:08] SPEAKER_00: talk to when they talk about their launch that first year always goes
[04:11] SPEAKER_00: terribly and I feel like everything that could have gone wrong for us did
[04:15] SPEAKER_00: but at the end of the day we just had a commitment that this is our
[04:19] SPEAKER_00: our life's work this is what we want to do and you can kind of
[04:23] SPEAKER_00: sell can give up and go back or you can just make it happen and we've been able
[04:27] SPEAKER_00: to make it happen our clients have been unbelievable and we've been
[04:31] SPEAKER_00: gaining a lot of traction within the market as people
[04:34] SPEAKER_00: still like an entrepreneurial story in Calgary and so that spirit has been
[04:39] SPEAKER_00: able to you know get us through what is a very challenging time within
[04:43] SPEAKER_00: you know downtown Calgary and and now the world with with COVID.
[04:47] SPEAKER_01: Now as you talked to to your clients out there like what's the sense of the
[04:53] SPEAKER_01: mood that you get from people when it comes to you know they're present
[04:58] SPEAKER_01: finances and they're and more importantly what they're thinking about the
[05:03] SPEAKER_00: future. Well it's really uh it's an age of change and I think for a lot in a lot
[05:08] SPEAKER_00: of ways COVID has provided this great reset for people to think about
[05:13] SPEAKER_00: what's really important maybe I can work a little bit more from home they always
[05:17] SPEAKER_00: said it wasn't possible but maybe it is what does that look like?
[05:20] SPEAKER_00: I actually don't like my job I actually don't want to do this I don't
[05:23] SPEAKER_00: you know like this house whatever it seems to be
[05:27] SPEAKER_00: conjuring up a bunch of questions and that is kind of where we can provide the
[05:32] SPEAKER_00: value in a lot of ways because we provide these interactive dashboards that allow
[05:36] SPEAKER_00: people to model out their decisions and see them within a full context of their
[05:41] SPEAKER_00: financial life and really put some data behind those big questions
[05:46] SPEAKER_00: play it out and let's see and maybe we can make a change and we're finding a
[05:50] SPEAKER_00: lot of people are looking to make a change at this time in the city.
[05:55] SPEAKER_01: Are you uh you know when you get chatting with these
[06:00] SPEAKER_01: people are you getting the sense that they're increasingly
[06:05] SPEAKER_01: more worried about where they're going to be 5, 10, 15, whatever years from now?
[06:13] SPEAKER_00: Very much so I mean it's there's different pockets within our client base and the
[06:17] SPEAKER_00: people that we help and build these financial dashboards for but you
[06:20] SPEAKER_00: definitely do see you know the full range of the spectrum we have quite a few
[06:25] SPEAKER_00: clients that are you know 35 to 45 starting businesses and having
[06:29] SPEAKER_00: tremendous success even in within this environment and able to take advantage of
[06:34] SPEAKER_00: the tremendous amount of high quality talent that's floating around right now
[06:38] SPEAKER_00: taking advantage of the fact that you know people are still
[06:41] SPEAKER_00: willing to back entrepreneurs in this city and you know rent is low for office space
[06:45] SPEAKER_00: so all those things do help kind of make these businesses go around and we have
[06:50] SPEAKER_00: seen some big successes there for some traditional oil and gas clients
[06:54] SPEAKER_00: definitely starting to see some behavioral changes you know the old
[06:58] SPEAKER_00: oil and get are the old Calgary portfolio is diversified by having oil and gas in the portfolio
[07:04] SPEAKER_00: and now people are starting to see the merits of having a bit more of a
[07:07] SPEAKER_00: discipline and diversifying your energy. What's your vision for the company, Eirah?
[07:12] SPEAKER_00: I really view Camber as a you know a health tech company in a lot of ways.
[07:18] SPEAKER_00: We could be grouped into a FinTech company or just a traditional wealth management company but
[07:23] SPEAKER_00: the health tech is what really excites me and I think that you know these companies like
[07:29] SPEAKER_00: Strava and Fitbit and Apple Watch and whoop are tremendously interesting because
[07:34] SPEAKER_00: they've gamified these kind of simple behaviors to good health. I mean if you think about a
[07:40] SPEAKER_00: a whoop wristband it's helping you you know eat, properly don't overeat, don't drink too much,
[07:46] SPEAKER_00: get eight hours of sleep every night and do a bit of exercise. I mean it's a very simple
[07:50] SPEAKER_00: recipe to good long-term health but the only way to get that result is by compounding that
[07:55] SPEAKER_00: behavior day after day after day and they've broken up this big goal of being healthy into these
[08:02] SPEAKER_00: little tiny manageable bites and then use kind of video game gamification elements in order to reward
[08:09] SPEAKER_00: the person to feel good about it to stay on track and allow that compounding behavior to
[08:16] SPEAKER_00: you know take place and so we're totally inspired by that because we think the simple recipe to
[08:21] SPEAKER_00: financial health is kind of you know keep your costs low don't do anything to complicated
[08:26] SPEAKER_00: state diversified stay in the market stay away from things that can hurt you but you need to find a
[08:31] SPEAKER_00: way to make those boring themes interesting and fun so that people stick to it and so we would
[08:37] SPEAKER_00: really like to see ourselves you know take some of that and implement that into the work that we do
[08:41] SPEAKER_00: and helping Canadian investors. Are you from Calgary? Saskatoon Saskatchewan. Oh wow! Rider fan boy!
[08:53] SPEAKER_01: So what made you start a business in Calgary and why Calgary? Calgary for me was always on the
[09:01] SPEAKER_00: radar because I had an uncle who's a mentor of mine and whenever I was around my uncle Rob you
[09:08] SPEAKER_00: know great things were happening and I just wanted a piece of that energy is one of these magical
[09:13] SPEAKER_00: people in the world and so I asked him getting out of university you know what what should I do?
[09:19] SPEAKER_00: What should I path be and he put me on the path to get into the investment business and to come
[09:25] SPEAKER_00: to Calgary and help me along the way so it was really a no-brainer for me to come to Calgary in
[09:30] SPEAKER_01: 2008 and I've loved it ever since. What do you think the advantages are of having a business or
[09:36] SPEAKER_00: starting up a business in this city? Again it's really that entrepreneurial spirit and in the
[09:42] SPEAKER_00: in the Calgary I think the city of Calgary put out an article about this old linsey manor deadman's
[09:50] SPEAKER_00: castle it's called in Elbow Park and it's this you know it was this beautiful house that was
[09:55] SPEAKER_00: supposed to be and it was a in 1913 a physician who made a very successful you know physician practice
[10:03] SPEAKER_00: then went into the gold rush made a bunch of money then became a speculator made a ton of money
[10:07] SPEAKER_00: was going to build this big beautiful house overlooking the Elbow River and of course because of
[10:11] SPEAKER_00: concentration and leverage he got the timing wrong and he gave back all the mass fortune that he made
[10:16] SPEAKER_00: and it never got built past these two big kind of gaunt statues that were the entrance of the house
[10:23] SPEAKER_00: and so I mean Calgary still had the guts 1913 that same mentality is here today concentration
[10:29] SPEAKER_00: and leverage when I came to Calgary in 2008 concentration and leverage was working so well for
[10:34] SPEAKER_00: people and made a massive huge force so 2009 it started going against them today it's going
[10:39] SPEAKER_00: to get them again but they still have that mentality and that energy and that optimism to start a
[10:47] SPEAKER_00: business be successful getting help and being able to do it at a young age I mean there's no
[10:52] SPEAKER_01: other city in Canada that provides that yeah exactly what do you have those what do you like about
[10:57] SPEAKER_01: being an entrepreneur but what are the some of the key things that keep you going working more
[11:05] SPEAKER_00: and making less exactly right you know it building something is very very special I had a great
[11:16] SPEAKER_00: career at my last firm they treated me very well and you know I was kind of set but that doesn't
[11:24] SPEAKER_00: bring a lot of fulfillment it's the kind of journey and trying to challenge things and make a
[11:29] SPEAKER_00: difference and build out the things that you're really passionate about and getting out on your
[11:34] SPEAKER_00: where you're not put into a box is an amazing feeling and I think amazing things can be built by
[11:40] SPEAKER_00: doing that and we're in an age of innovation and we're in an age when you can start these companies
[11:45] SPEAKER_00: for much cheaper than ever before and so when you have an opportunity to you know be able to work
[11:51] SPEAKER_00: for yourself and build something that you're truly authentically passionate about why why wouldn't
[11:55] SPEAKER_01: you do that yeah then when you know along your journey in in professional life is there anybody or
[12:02] SPEAKER_01: any place or thing that you can recall where you received the best piece of advice for being an
[12:08] SPEAKER_00: entrepreneur I don't know if this is good advice but it's something that I live by and like but I
[12:14] SPEAKER_00: I still like the art of the handshake deal I try not to paper things up too too much and definitely
[12:19] SPEAKER_00: that's gone against me in the past but I think having that view of the world that people are going
[12:25] SPEAKER_00: to treat you fairly and that if it doesn't work out you can come to a reasonable conclusion it's
[12:29] SPEAKER_00: just a nicer way to live and there's a lot of advice around there about getting everything
[12:34] SPEAKER_00: perfect and figuring out all these out clauses and papering it up and I just almost think that's
[12:38] SPEAKER_00: you know setting yourself up for failure so not to recommend this to other entrepreneurs to go
[12:44] SPEAKER_00: at this style but I kind of like the cowboy style of a handshake deal trying to figure it out because
[12:49] SPEAKER_00: there's so many unknowns when you're starting a business of which direction is it going to go and
[12:53] SPEAKER_00: who's going to be valuable and who's not who's going to come for the ride and who's not I just don't
[12:56] SPEAKER_00: know how you can kind of paper it up perfectly and I rather just view the world as a place where
[13:02] SPEAKER_00: you can trust people and where you know everything broke out and for the most part I think that's true.
[13:07] SPEAKER_01: So do you think there's some special qualities or personality that lead to success on the entrepreneurial
[13:15] SPEAKER_01: side of things like what do you need to be an entrepreneur? I think it's it's all shapes and sizes
[13:21] SPEAKER_00: from what I can see at Canberra we're very fortunate to work with a lot of entrepreneurs as
[13:26] SPEAKER_00: clients and you know we really see the full gambit but it is an optimistic lens of the world
[13:33] SPEAKER_00: and an ability to see the positives and not just the negatives as well as just being able to get
[13:41] SPEAKER_00: things done I think when you run these businesses you just have to not be afraid to be the IT guy
[13:47] SPEAKER_00: one day and the janitor the next day and the you know the lawyer the next day you kind of got to
[13:51] SPEAKER_01: do it all yeah now you know you alluded to the to the amount of time it takes and any entrepreneur
[13:59] SPEAKER_01: will tell you that right it you know you put your heart and soul into your business and that
[14:04] SPEAKER_01: usually takes time and a lot of it during the day how do you strike a balance I guess you know
[14:11] SPEAKER_01: the in terms of work and life by being an entrepreneur yeah it's a good question I'm not sure
[14:18] SPEAKER_00: I'm going to have a very good answer for you you know I think it's an interesting time when I look
[14:21] SPEAKER_00: at younger entrepreneurs and I just have the most experience I guess with them there's just such
[14:27] SPEAKER_00: less of a divide between the personal and the business a lot of my clients are close friends of mine
[14:34] SPEAKER_00: a lot of the work that I do is you know totally aligned with my own personal interests so to
[14:39] SPEAKER_00: split those two apart is quite hard to see in these first you know we're only kind of 20 months old
[14:45] SPEAKER_00: there isn't a lot of time for anything else my wife and I had a baby in March and so that is
[14:52] SPEAKER_00: my recharge and where I put all my extra energy coming home from the office but there isn't too much
[14:58] SPEAKER_00: extra time outside of that these days what kind of interest do you have outside of work well I'm a big
[15:05] SPEAKER_00: I'm a big reader again kind of student of the industry but I think there's a lot to be learned
[15:11] SPEAKER_00: about the industry through looking at other fields history even fiction so I do like to read and
[15:18] SPEAKER_00: then you know the best way to kind of recharge for me is getting a bit of extra thought so
[15:22] SPEAKER_00: love to be in the gym love to play tennis and love to go skiing okay super now I just wanted to come
[15:28] SPEAKER_01: back to the financial stuff for a second you know one of the things that I noticed recently
[15:35] SPEAKER_01: was the fact that there's a report on the financial literacy of people out there and it was quite
[15:41] SPEAKER_01: low do you think that people need and especially now even more so than at any other time to really
[15:49] SPEAKER_01: have a handle and understanding about finances and money in these times definitely I mean the other
[15:57] SPEAKER_00: part of that report is that the confidence around their financial knowledge ranks quite high
[16:04] SPEAKER_00: you know a percent of people think they're good drivers will mathematically that's impossible so
[16:08] SPEAKER_00: is the same thing and it can be very very costly to be overconfident and with a misunderstanding
[16:15] SPEAKER_00: of how markets work and I do think that's a real problem I know you were you know a sports writer
[16:22] SPEAKER_00: for many years and yeah you know the baseball player that I think draws the most parallel to
[16:28] SPEAKER_00: Canberra is Ted Williams of one of the greatest hitters of all time he had a batting average of
[16:33] SPEAKER_00: you know 400 that means 60 percent of the time he didn't hit the ball so you know as a person
[16:40] SPEAKER_00: who doesn't know baseball you could go and see Ted Williams the greatest hitter of all time you
[16:43] SPEAKER_00: could see him you know play a full game and never touch the ball and that then would lead to
[16:48] SPEAKER_00: information to that person that maybe Ted Williams you know that's not the guy I thought he was
[16:53] SPEAKER_00: investing is so much like that you know the best investment behaviors that we can prove over
[16:58] SPEAKER_00: you know 120 years of data only works 60 percent of the time on a one year rolling basis so investing
[17:05] SPEAKER_00: can feel wrong a lot even though you're making the best decisions at the time that you made that
[17:10] SPEAKER_00: decision because the future is uncertain and there's so much randomness and complexity within
[17:15] SPEAKER_00: what plays out in financial markets and investment decisions and that lead is a lot of false
[17:20] SPEAKER_00: positives and a lot of false negatives around investing they have people have this you know sample
[17:27] SPEAKER_00: size of one it happened to me and they don't see that that's not a very probabilistic way to view
[17:32] SPEAKER_00: markets and investing and so training that is very very difficult but very very important in an age
[17:39] SPEAKER_00: where you know people used to have pensions and that money was professionally managed well now
[17:43] SPEAKER_00: you don't get a pension you're given the money and you're told well go figure it out on your own
[17:47] SPEAKER_00: well raising a family well you know trying to you know do your job well well trying to strike off
[17:52] SPEAKER_00: a few hobbies and you know stay personally healthy you just can't do it all and so we really need
[17:58] SPEAKER_00: to raise the financial literacy in Canada but not totally put the honest just on the individual to
[18:02] SPEAKER_00: you know stack another thing on their plate when this is a very very complex subject in order to
[18:08] SPEAKER_00: understand and operate in efficiently yeah exactly all right well super I wronged by really
[18:13] SPEAKER_01: appreciate taking a time to do this it has been a pleasure thank you so much okay that has been
[18:20] SPEAKER_01: robbed towns and newest founder and CEO of camber of bintek and wealth management company in Calgary
[18:27] SPEAKER_01: this has been Calgary's podcast on canada's podcast network I'm your host Mario Tonigusi
[18:33] SPEAKER_01: thanks for joining us today