How brands can build safe connections with their target consumers

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[00:00] SPEAKER_00: Welcome to Canada's Podcast.
[00:05] SPEAKER_00: Hello, this is Robert Smigel, coming today with Canada's podcast
[00:09] SPEAKER_00: where we talk to the entrepreneurs who are making it happen here in British Columbia.
[00:13] SPEAKER_00: Today, our guest is Jason Williams.
[00:15] SPEAKER_00: Jason is the CEO of KITOS, the largest mobile advertising network that safely reaches hundreds of millions of kids,
[00:23] SPEAKER_00: teens and families every month.
[00:25] SPEAKER_00: Mobile games use the KITOS platform to monetize with safe ads that don't track or profile players
[00:31] SPEAKER_00: unlike most digital advertising systems.
[00:34] SPEAKER_00: In addition to his role as CEO, Jason Lenz's expertise as a guest lecture at CAS Business School
[00:41] SPEAKER_00: and University College London, he has a bachelor's of commerce degree from the University of Victoria
[00:46] SPEAKER_00: and an MBA specializing in strategic marketing from the University of Awarwick.
[00:52] SPEAKER_00: Jason, you sound like a busy man.
[00:54] SPEAKER_00: Hi. Thank you. Great to be here. How are you?
[00:57] SPEAKER_00: Good. Good. Okay. Well, welcome to Canada's Podcast and taking the time to be here.
[01:02] SPEAKER_00: Let tell us a little bit more about yourself. I know you're from Vancouver, but you spent some time in London
[01:07] SPEAKER_00: and so give us a breakdown.
[01:08] SPEAKER_01: Yeah. So I'm from BC, from Vancouver, Born and Raised.
[01:14] SPEAKER_01: You know, I had a great time here growing up and then headed over to Victoria
[01:17] SPEAKER_01: where I did a stint at UVic and got myself a commerce degree there.
[01:23] SPEAKER_01: And then I started working in tech after a short stint in Toronto and finance actually.
[01:29] SPEAKER_01: And then came back to the West Coast working in tech in around 2000 during the first .com boom there.
[01:37] SPEAKER_01: And then that led me bounced around a little bit, a couple of ventures and then headed off to London
[01:44] SPEAKER_01: and working on a game's project there for a number of years actually what was one year turned into about 15 in London.
[01:54] SPEAKER_01: And a few different projects in games and platform and grabbed myself an MBA while I was spending some time over there.
[02:02] SPEAKER_01: It was always an interest of mine to to level up on that kind of strategic marketing and strategy competition area, which has always fascinated me.
[02:11] SPEAKER_01: And then actually just headed back to BC this year with the kiddos growing nicely under us.
[02:19] SPEAKER_01: Great exciting business, 40 plus employees and having a good time with that.
[02:25] SPEAKER_00: Great. Well, businesses need money. How did you get financing to start your company and how do you currently make money in your business now?
[02:32] SPEAKER_01: Right. Yeah. Well, we raised capital from mostly private investors during our early days.
[02:40] SPEAKER_01: And so we had, we're very fortunate after the very hard work it is to raise capital to find people through the network who believed in the story and helped us to get to where we are today.
[02:56] SPEAKER_01: And kiddos makes money. We're an advertising network. And so we sell advertising to brands mostly.
[03:05] SPEAKER_01: The Legos and Disney's and Mattels of the world who want to reach children, compliantly and safely. And they do so on our mobile network.
[03:14] SPEAKER_01: And we run those ads out and we take a percentage of that spend where another percentage flows to the person who runs the app, the app owner.
[03:26] SPEAKER_00: Interesting. I want you to give me a key piece of knowledge or information about the industry you just described so our listeners can win from this.
[03:35] SPEAKER_01: Sure. Yeah. Well, advertising technology is a fascinating and very deep industry that covers, you know, everywhere from sales and marketing to very in-depth global 24 hour operations and then deep, deep tech.
[03:51] SPEAKER_01: And it's a fascinating area, very high moving. And I really enjoyed it. And one aspect that's interesting, I think that I could share is that almost every ad that you or anyone is looking at on their phone or on the web.
[04:09] SPEAKER_01: It's tracking you. It's profiling you. It's sharing that it's putting everything that you did and saw around it into a database and it's getting carried around with you. And that break is something that Apple and Google have kind of been pushing against.
[04:24] SPEAKER_01: And it's what we built is the opposite of that. We don't share track or profile anything. And that's what makes us safe.
[04:31] SPEAKER_00: Okay. What's the long term vision and what we are company looked like in the future? Do you see the company expanding into other areas and where beyond Banguver BC or even Canada?
[04:41] SPEAKER_01: Well, we're a global company, actually. So we're we have offices, but they're they're not used hugely. So we're actually we have employees in 11 countries in 14 time zones and out of that 40 people. And so we look for the best people around the world.
[04:59] SPEAKER_01: So we've got a lot here in Canada and in different parts of Canada, actually, we've got BC Alberta, Ontario, just those three right now, but and also many other countries and I could go into that.
[05:13] SPEAKER_01: But what's our vision or vision is to be the most used and most high performance way to reach kids safely with advertising. So our goal is to be YouTube really because that's the number one right now.
[05:33] SPEAKER_00: Okay, let's talk a little bit about Banguver. You're from West Vancouver right now. I want you to tell me what is the biggest benefits for you and to be an entrepreneur in Vancouver BC. I want you to give some of the good points about starting a company here, but also some of the tough things are challenges usually challenges you've had for a little bit so they can keep an eye for them.
[05:51] SPEAKER_01: I think one of the the greatest things about Vancouver is that it does have a good technology spirit and technology kind of startup.
[06:04] SPEAKER_01: The game's industry has deep, deep roots here and that has spun off so many different businesses. And I think that actually the talent here is very, very good, good quality people, hard working people.
[06:21] SPEAKER_01: And comparatively, if you were to to try and hire that same person down the coast a little bit, you'd get a much higher price tag. And so if we were to graph capacity and cost, then Vancouver would be a big winner. And actually, you know, maybe that's a roading a little bit now because so many other companies have identified that like Microsoft and Amazon and they're all moving here too because they want to take advantage of that great talent and you know,
[06:51] SPEAKER_01: they're not just a $80,000 but it still exists and not everybody wants to work for Amazon. And so there's a lot of great, great people and we've harnessed them here. So that's I think the pluses, good network, good roots, good tech and good people.
[07:07] SPEAKER_01: I think the main negative of Vancouver is probably the time zone, you know, it's, there's a lot of business. It's a global world.
[07:16] SPEAKER_01: You've got to be hustling hard as an entrepreneur in a lot of markets. And if you think that you can run from 930 to 530, you're missing a lot of potential on a specific time zone. So it can be tricky from that perspective.
[07:32] SPEAKER_00: And there's 6 a.m. meetings can be difficult.
[07:36] SPEAKER_01: Yeah, I'm an expert at 6 a.m. meetings. So it's just part of the territory.
[07:42] SPEAKER_00: Okay, you've been in and out of Canada a lot. So we do have a lot of immigration coming into Canada into particular Vancouver. If you were to start all over again, you just moved here to Vancouver, BC, but this time you don't know anyone knowing what you know now. What would you do? How would you go about starting all over again as an entrepreneur?
[08:02] SPEAKER_01: Well, I would definitely do my best to network to find some technical co founders. If I wasn't technical myself, you definitely need someone to help bring an idea beyond a piece of paper.
[08:21] SPEAKER_01: And then I would network into the VC and early stage funding opportunities, whether it's governmental or private. And so the combination of those two things.
[08:35] SPEAKER_01: And be open with your ideation, like, you know, definitely it's good to have a passion, but also money in entrepreneurship ebbs and flows to different segments and sectors.
[08:50] SPEAKER_01: And actually being a little bit ahead of the right sector segment or sector is more important than the quality of your vision on day one. You've got to be in the right place at the right time.
[09:05] SPEAKER_00: Yeah, absolutely. Let's talk a little about your routine entrepreneurs like a very routine discipline individuals. What does the first hour look like for you when you get up in the morning? Do you have a specific routine or ritual that helps you get motivated start your day?
[09:20] SPEAKER_01: You know, I try not to get too bad too late because I get up very early. So I'm up usually in the fives and I don't like to rush onto the screen, but I do usually have a six o'clock.
[09:32] SPEAKER_01: And so I kind of stretch walk around the house a little bit, you know, get get tidied up and just get ready for the day. And then I'm on and I'm engaging with the thing about our business is it's a 20 when you run a network. It's a 24 hour business. And so from the second I wake up, there's a whole slew of things interesting things that are happening and great people to talk to who've already been working for.
[10:02] SPEAKER_01: 10 or more hours. Some people are even, you know, looking forward to signing off who like our team in Asia. And so it's it's just about trying to find the right energy for creativity and problem solving and just that work that anybody brings each day, but consistency is so important.
[10:26] SPEAKER_00: Entrepreneurs like to read. You're a very you are a very academic person with an academic background. What books are you reading now and why are even audiobooks and can you recommend any books for listeners who are also entrepreneurs.
[10:39] SPEAKER_01: Sure. Yeah, no, I'm a big student of many things. I love I love history. I love entrepreneurship. I love, you know, all sorts of different things. But for me, what I'm besides history, what I'm studying right now is just the ways that brands position themselves. And I have actually rereading a couple of books that I think are super foundational.
[11:05] SPEAKER_01: One of them there is actually they wrote a few, but it's by Al Ries and Jack Trout and these two are marketeers from I think the 80s actually and they wrote a particular book called positioning the battle for your consumers mind or it's about positioning and it's it's fundamental for any entrepreneur because it's about how you can position your brand or your business in a busy marketplace and be remembered.
[11:34] SPEAKER_01: And then they wrote a follow on book, which was called marketing warfare and it describes tactics for entering a market as an unknown and what are different ways that you can operate to be successful. And I think these they're reading their writing is that is super foundation has helped me tremendously because you cannot bang your head against the wall fighting a big incumbent and expect to get anywhere.
[12:03] SPEAKER_01: You have to be creative. You got to think about ways that you can open opportunities that aren't already taken. So I recommend those any online or offline tools that you use on a daily basis that you could recommend entrepreneurs or Canada.
[12:21] SPEAKER_00: About Canada.
[12:23] SPEAKER_00: No, no, no, like to entrepreneur like you use tools or you think that you could recommend to other entrepreneurs if they can use that.
[12:29] SPEAKER_00: What do you use daily that works? Yeah.
[12:32] SPEAKER_01: I mean, I'm quite ingrained with my Google products. There's nothing that's super wild that I use every day. I'm I follow my calendar. I'm on my email. I love Slack with the team.
[12:46] SPEAKER_01: So we're fairly traditional in that regard. And for me, you know, communication. I spend a lot of time on zoom, love zoom. And no, there's no particular tool. I take notes on on my phone whenever I'm thinking of things. I have different systems that I use for like if I remember something.
[13:07] SPEAKER_01: I send myself an email and then that works its way into different to do lists that I use. And so I think, you know, always being on top of one's thoughts and having a good system. I think it comes down to what works for you. And everybody's got their own systems. But I do think that harnessing the I the concepts to grab your ideas when they're on the even when you're on the go is super important.
[13:30] SPEAKER_00: Okay, let's get to know you a little bit better. If you weren't doing what you do now, what would you like to do for profession?
[13:38] SPEAKER_01: Okay. Well, I mean, obviously my track record says that I love technology and I love the concepts of strategy and marketing and I'm very passionate about those.
[13:49] SPEAKER_01: But I do have particular passions and hobbies and probably, you know, outside of spending time with my family, which everyone could say is that my two main passions are our martial arts. I really enjoy rigorous exercise and through martial art is a lot of fun and helps to kind of clear one's mind.
[14:10] SPEAKER_01: And I'm also passionate about electronic music. And so I follow a lot of different events and DJs and producers within electronic.
[14:24] SPEAKER_00: What kind of a job would you not like to do? I couldn't do it.
[14:29] SPEAKER_01: That's interesting. I've always said that, you know, I would happily just open a flower shopper or sit in a convenience store. What could I not do?
[14:44] SPEAKER_01: I don't know. I'd have to think of something that was just absurdly monotonous. I think would have to be it.
[14:53] SPEAKER_00: Repeditive something repetitive that is like too repetitive that you cannot.
[14:58] SPEAKER_01: Yes, it's an excellent document at the same time.
[15:01] SPEAKER_00: It's an excellent document and move numbers around all day.
[15:04] SPEAKER_01: Yeah, I guess. I mean, like, I'm a kind of a dreamer type of person. So like as long as I'm free with my thoughts and I could plug into something at least a percentage of that time.
[15:17] SPEAKER_01: If I'm locked in a box and I'm not allowed to listen to a podcast or a history documentary, then I'd be sad.
[15:24] SPEAKER_01: But as long as I have some freedom to ingest, then I'm good.
[15:28] SPEAKER_00: In business, what's your favorite word, quote, or sentence that you like to use? Is there anything that you frequently find yourself?
[15:35] SPEAKER_01: Yeah, yeah, no, I like it's Peter Drucker, who is a famous business thought leader.
[15:43] SPEAKER_01: And he said the best way to predict the future is to create it.
[15:51] SPEAKER_01: So that's my favorite one.
[15:53] SPEAKER_00: What's your least favorite word or sentence you do not like to hear?
[15:58] SPEAKER_01: Well, we run a 24 hour network. It's dependent on 24 hour systems.
[16:04] SPEAKER_01: And so the worst thing to hear is we're down.
[16:11] SPEAKER_01: Because when it's down, the phone starts ringing and everybody's, oh, it's, it's bad.
[16:17] SPEAKER_01: So it happens.
[16:18] SPEAKER_00: Yeah, get you trying to get out of get out of bed.
[16:21] SPEAKER_00: Oh, yeah.
[16:22] SPEAKER_01: Go time.
[16:23] SPEAKER_00: If you had to pick one or two words to describe yourself, what would it be and why?
[16:30] SPEAKER_01: I would say persistent.
[16:34] SPEAKER_01: I think would be good. Good one.
[16:36] SPEAKER_01: I think that that's definitely something that characterizes me.
[16:42] SPEAKER_01: And you know, I think with the team and just in my life, I like to have fun.
[16:48] SPEAKER_01: So, you know, I like to keep it light. I like to bring humor.
[16:51] SPEAKER_01: I like, you know, people to express themselves.
[16:54] SPEAKER_01: I like people to work in the way that makes them happy.
[16:58] SPEAKER_01: And so that they can bring them best selves.
[17:00] SPEAKER_01: And so I think fun would be, I hope I'm fun.
[17:05] SPEAKER_01: It's definitely a fun place.
[17:07] SPEAKER_01: I don't know if anyone else would be patient.
[17:09] SPEAKER_00: Oh, yeah, I think I think I saw it to do with company culture too.
[17:12] SPEAKER_00: I think some places are so serious that, you know, if you're there eight, ten hours a day,
[17:17] SPEAKER_00: 15 hours a day, you got to break the monotony and have a little bit of flavor in that.
[17:22] SPEAKER_01: Exactly. Like, you know, no matter how difficult or complex or serious to ask is,
[17:29] SPEAKER_01: you know, you've got to bring some humor and have some fun with it.
[17:32] SPEAKER_00: Yeah. Anything keeping you up at night, do you take your work to better to you?
[17:36] SPEAKER_00: Or you can you shut it off and wait till the morning to start up again?
[17:40] SPEAKER_01: No, no, no, I can't shut it off. So unless I'm, well, yeah,
[17:45] SPEAKER_01: unless I'm doing a martial art, I can't shut it off.
[17:47] SPEAKER_01: Because only only when someone's trying to attack me is the only time I can't think about it.
[17:54] SPEAKER_01: So, no, what scares me is, I mean, in tech and in, you know,
[17:59] SPEAKER_01: we're a little bit bigger now, but you're always operating on the edge of,
[18:05] SPEAKER_01: you could say the razor's head, but one analogy that I liked is that,
[18:08] SPEAKER_01: like, in surfing or looking at a wave,
[18:13] SPEAKER_01: the top of that cresting wave, it has the most potential,
[18:17] SPEAKER_01: but it's also got the most risk.
[18:19] SPEAKER_01: Because if things go wrong, you crash.
[18:22] SPEAKER_01: And so in tech, you're never really safe.
[18:26] SPEAKER_01: Like, even giant Google, like, look what just happened to Google.
[18:29] SPEAKER_01: I mean, they thought they were safe. They had it paved.
[18:32] SPEAKER_01: Boom, everyone's going to use Google forever.
[18:34] SPEAKER_01: And then here comes chat, TPPT, and Microsoft gets this huge burst.
[18:38] SPEAKER_01: So like, you never really know what tomorrow is going to bring.
[18:41] SPEAKER_01: And maybe that's part of the excitement, but it also keeps you up at night.
[18:45] SPEAKER_00: Entrepreneurs, as you know, have many mentors and people that advise them.
[18:49] SPEAKER_00: Do you have any advice that you may have received that you can pass on to entrepreneurs throughout Canada?
[18:55] SPEAKER_01: Sure. Yeah. No, of course.
[18:57] SPEAKER_01: One of my great mentors had a saying that he'll love to say.
[19:04] SPEAKER_01: And that is what you gain on the swings, you lose on the roundabouts,
[19:09] SPEAKER_01: which is the concept for, you know, don't sweat a loss because you're going to get a gain somewhere else.
[19:16] SPEAKER_01: And, you know, let, of course, celebrate the win, but you're going to lose something somewhere else.
[19:21] SPEAKER_01: So it's going to work out.
[19:22] SPEAKER_01: And you just got to keep pushing and banging and, you know, doing your best and have some fun with it.
[19:29] SPEAKER_00: So you're saying, don't go too high and don't go too low.
[19:32] SPEAKER_01: Keep it. I'm just saying you can't sweat the, the losses, you know?
[19:35] SPEAKER_01: Like it's like, if you get a bump one day, you know, you might get a trough the next.
[19:41] SPEAKER_01: And what you have to do is to stay steady and consistent.
[19:44] SPEAKER_01: And, and that's where that saying comes from.
[19:47] SPEAKER_00: Okay. Great. Okay.
[19:50] SPEAKER_00: We're going to wrap this up, Jason.
[19:51] SPEAKER_00: How can our listeners get whole of you?
[19:52] SPEAKER_00: Whole of you? And is there anything you'd like to add before you leave us today?
[19:59] SPEAKER_01: Entrepreneurs can get a hold of me anytime.
[20:01] SPEAKER_01: So, yeah, it's Jason J. A also and at kiddoskideoz.net.
[20:07] SPEAKER_01: And write to me anytime.
[20:09] SPEAKER_01: Love to hear your, your about your journey.
[20:12] SPEAKER_01: And I think, you know, just parting words.
[20:14] SPEAKER_01: I'd love to say that, you know, stay focused young entrepreneurs.
[20:19] SPEAKER_01: Like believe in that idea, bring something to fruition.
[20:23] SPEAKER_01: Send those emails late at night.
[20:25] SPEAKER_01: You know, knock on doors.
[20:27] SPEAKER_01: And there is, you know, great opportunity.
[20:33] SPEAKER_01: And I think now more than ever, anyone can, anywhere can come up with the right idea to enable themselves to be their own boss.
[20:42] SPEAKER_01: And so just believe it and push and be persistent.
[20:47] SPEAKER_01: Persistence is important.
[20:49] SPEAKER_00: Okay. Great. Jason, thanks for coming on the show.
[20:52] SPEAKER_00: I've learned a lot about you and I'm sure our listeners have as well.
[20:55] SPEAKER_00: Thank you. Great to be here.
[21:04] SPEAKER_00: We'll see you next time.