Canada’s Podcast and Perceptible Discuss the COVID-19 Crisis and Breaking Through the Isolation

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[00:00] SPEAKER_00: It's the Canada's podcast network.
[00:02] SPEAKER_00: Hi, everybody. It's Bonnie LG and welcome to Canada's podcast.
[00:07] SPEAKER_00: Canada's leading entrepreneurial podcast network.
[00:10] SPEAKER_00: With COVID-19 making many of us question how we will make it through
[00:15] SPEAKER_00: the next weeks or months,
[00:16] SPEAKER_00: we thought we would begin to add new items and opinions
[00:20] SPEAKER_00: from some of Canada's entrepreneurs who are part of
[00:23] SPEAKER_00: our ever growing network.
[00:25] SPEAKER_00: Many have been through personal experiences
[00:28] SPEAKER_00: that can resonate today.
[00:30] SPEAKER_00: And hopefully some of this will be passed on to our listeners
[00:33] SPEAKER_00: and help you as you figure out your response to today's challenges.
[00:38] SPEAKER_00: The fact is most of us can and will work through this
[00:41] SPEAKER_00: and break through on the other side with new ideas and success.
[00:46] SPEAKER_00: So today let's chat to two of the guys behind Canada's podcast
[00:51] SPEAKER_00: and its parent company Perceptible Group.
[00:53] SPEAKER_00: Please join me in welcoming Leandro Dummel
[00:56] SPEAKER_00: and Phil Bliss.
[00:58] SPEAKER_00: So Phil, you've been a business for a long time
[01:01] SPEAKER_00: and I'm wondering what would you tell our listeners today
[01:04] SPEAKER_00: in terms of how they can best navigate these challenging times?
[01:09] SPEAKER_01: Well, you know, I don't want to be paternalistic or anything,
[01:12] SPEAKER_01: but I mean for me, the most important thing is to think
[01:17] SPEAKER_01: and to care about others and look for opportunity.
[01:21] SPEAKER_01: You know, the key thing is we tend to get isolated like this,
[01:25] SPEAKER_01: but you've got to keep, you've got to look for opportunity.
[01:28] SPEAKER_01: You have to be fearless, but not stupid.
[01:32] SPEAKER_01: And if you do that, then you should break out of the other end.
[01:36] SPEAKER_01: I think that that stuff, that would be my kind of capsule that it allows.
[01:41] SPEAKER_00: The Andrew, do you want to add anything to that?
[01:44] SPEAKER_02: Absolutely. I totally agree with Phil.
[01:47] SPEAKER_02: You know, you have to be fearless, but also smart, right?
[01:50] SPEAKER_02: You can't just kind of take risky chances.
[01:53] SPEAKER_02: Especially in today's climate, but you also need to take risks.
[02:00] SPEAKER_02: I also, you know, take a look at the evolution of entrepreneurs through adversity.
[02:08] SPEAKER_02: If we take a look at what happened back in 9-11,
[02:11] SPEAKER_02: I was still in school back then, but I can imagine myself being an entrepreneur at that time.
[02:16] SPEAKER_02: I would probably be facing a lot of anxiety as well.
[02:19] SPEAKER_02: I probably would have thoughts that the world is ending.
[02:23] SPEAKER_02: I know that for many, many, many months, people were even afraid to travel, right?
[02:28] SPEAKER_02: But, you know, things got better, and the economy got better.
[02:33] SPEAKER_02: Businesses thrived after that, and I do believe that, you know,
[02:38] SPEAKER_02: opportunity lies in adversity, and we need to just be able to weather this storm.
[02:43] SPEAKER_02: And I think that beyond that will be greener pastures.
[02:49] SPEAKER_00: Phil, in some of our conversations, you've shared stories about
[02:54] SPEAKER_00: starting more than one business during a recession, and I'm wondering if you can share
[02:59] SPEAKER_00: a couple of personal experiences with me.
[03:00] SPEAKER_01: I'll do that. You know, I'm the older, so I have an only chance.
[03:05] SPEAKER_01: I think I've actually lived through four recessions, maybe a couple of other blips,
[03:10] SPEAKER_01: but whatever term recessions. But I mean, just to look at the dot bomb, if you like, the 9-11,
[03:16] SPEAKER_01: one, which was a double hit. You know, first of all, we got dot bomb, and about, you know,
[03:23] SPEAKER_01: it was 15 months later, we got 9-11. I lost 5 million dollars worth of business in two weeks
[03:33] SPEAKER_01: with the dot bomb, because the investment just got pulled away, and my clients folded.
[03:39] SPEAKER_01: Okay, so there was nothing I could do about it. We stayed in business, it was very, very hard,
[03:45] SPEAKER_01: but you know, that was sort of the name of the game. How do we stay in business?
[03:52] SPEAKER_01: Well, we started to transition and realized, you know, after dot bomb, the technology side of
[03:57] SPEAKER_01: business was a wasteland. I mean, you know, so a marketing company servicing that wasn't going
[04:04] SPEAKER_01: to be getting a lot of business. So we looked at where could we take our skills in, you know,
[04:10] SPEAKER_01: that early web development UX, all that kind of thing. And higher ed was glaring us in the face.
[04:19] SPEAKER_01: Fortunately, I had someone introduce me to another company that had a very good background at higher
[04:24] SPEAKER_01: ed, and Lauren, we were old, you know, nine months later after partying on a few jobs, we merged
[04:29] SPEAKER_01: together. You know, but having said that, 9-11 hit, and again, we all took a dive. And I think
[04:37] SPEAKER_01: there was just good operation. It wasn't really a recession. There was just good operations,
[04:42] SPEAKER_01: minimizing overhead. And most of us, you know, made it through kind of like now, maybe three or
[04:47] SPEAKER_01: four months of a flatten. And then it very quickly came, came back. So that was, that was really
[04:55] SPEAKER_01: a different, you know, you know, in 2008, just to give it just three that we all remember,
[05:01] SPEAKER_01: higher ed was kind of dwindling a little bit, not dwindling, but not as promising as it
[05:07] SPEAKER_01: had been. So we were, we were within higher ed realizing that technology was lifting off. So
[05:13] SPEAKER_01: therefore we started to develop basically Facebook applications, research online, online research
[05:20] SPEAKER_01: applications. And, you know, we didn't really mean we did, we did okay, but we didn't, we don't.
[05:27] SPEAKER_01: We were at one of the big guys that made it, made it through the night, just about none of us did.
[05:31] SPEAKER_01: So that side of it didn't work, but what we did was reposition ourselves as a technology specialist
[05:38] SPEAKER_01: by doing that and having a team that really understood that and could sell those skills to others.
[05:45] SPEAKER_01: So, you know, a bit like you were saying with SEO and getting in early, we were right there at the
[05:50] SPEAKER_01: beginning of the social movement, not only on a posting and a this and a that, but actually on
[05:56] SPEAKER_01: that level, on technical level, integration and all that kind of thing. So that's where you go,
[06:02] SPEAKER_01: you go, you look at, look at what people are going to really need as a breakout of this kind of
[06:08] SPEAKER_01: change. And if you, if you spot it right, then you're a winner. How about you, Andrew? Have you,
[06:14] SPEAKER_00: do you have an example from your career where you had to make lemonade out of some lemons?
[06:20] SPEAKER_02: Absolutely. You know, we've all gone through our ups and downs. Some are, you know,
[06:26] SPEAKER_02: been, been, um, elating highs and the downs can be, you know, soul-crushing moments.
[06:34] SPEAKER_02: So it's actually coincidentally back in 2003, I started off my career as an entrepreneur.
[06:41] SPEAKER_02: And what happened there was, um, we actually got affected by the SARS epidemic. I don't know if you
[06:49] SPEAKER_02: know what's different from this, really. Exactly. And six months, um, during and after, we literally
[06:57] SPEAKER_02: lost all of our clients. So as a reason, graduate, you know, putting kind of like our heart and soul
[07:05] SPEAKER_02: into the, the company, it was, it was a soul-shattering. But, you know, like all entrepreneurs,
[07:11] SPEAKER_02: right? Like we're, we're tough. One of my passions is actually a boxing and in boxing, we have a
[07:16] SPEAKER_02: saying that, um, you get knocked down seven times. You get back up eight times. You just keep
[07:21] SPEAKER_02: getting back up. So that's what I did. I literally picked myself off the floor. I went and printed
[07:29] SPEAKER_02: 50 resumes. I went old school. I literally hit the pavement, started knocking on people's doors,
[07:38] SPEAKER_02: looking for a job. And I kid you not, um, it was my second last resume. I went into a startup,
[07:44] SPEAKER_02: which was actually great because it was a good fit. I had, you know, kind of the contributor to
[07:49] SPEAKER_02: mindset. And they weren't looking for any help at that time, but they really liked the initiative. They
[07:55] SPEAKER_02: the kind of the attitude and the assertiveness. I explained to them my situation. So they weren't
[08:01] SPEAKER_02: looking for anybody, but they did open up a spot for me. It was temporary. And, um, you know, lucky for
[08:06] SPEAKER_02: me, you know, I got in and six months later, I was actually heading the creative and design team.
[08:14] SPEAKER_02: And within that six months, I was actually even, um, able to build our SEO team as well.
[08:21] SPEAKER_02: If you could think of it back in 03, SEO was a fairly, uh, alien construct.
[08:25] SPEAKER_02: You know, for me, that's an example of, um, lemonade out of lemons.
[08:30] SPEAKER_00: For sure. And I think, you know, building office something Phil said right at the top,
[08:35] SPEAKER_00: um, to go into this time also with an attitude of, um, service. And how can we help each other? And
[08:42] SPEAKER_00: as a solo entrepreneur, I've reached out to all of my clients, you know, whether they're current or
[08:49] SPEAKER_00: past clients over the last couple of weeks and just said, is there anything I can do to help?
[08:53] SPEAKER_00: And it's led to several new engagements, you know, and new business opportunities just by coming
[08:59] SPEAKER_00: in and saying, what do you need? And how can I help you connect with the people who are most
[09:04] SPEAKER_00: important to your organization? Um, and it's interesting to see too, how we even competitors in, in,
[09:11] SPEAKER_00: a traditional business setting maybe coming together to help each other out for the greater good.
[09:17] SPEAKER_00: Well, absolutely. Yeah. And wondering, I mean, we're hearing a lot about, you know, everyone,
[09:22] SPEAKER_00: uh, now being asked to work from home across the country. Do you have some tips on how to stay
[09:30] SPEAKER_00: focused when you work from home or, uh, resources that you would direct people to that could maybe
[09:36] SPEAKER_01: help with, with productivity? You know, I think working from home, my tip is, uh, look at what you're
[09:44] SPEAKER_01: doing. I mean, I, I was giving a friend of mine who runs a training business, a crane training
[09:50] SPEAKER_01: business, actually. And you'd had, I don't know, a dozen cancellations, postponements, not
[09:56] SPEAKER_01: several cancellations. And I said, well, why don't you do it virtually? And so I actually was
[10:02] SPEAKER_01: giving him a run, walking him through zoom a little bit and realizing, you know, and he realized
[10:08] SPEAKER_01: just like I'll do here, you realize, you know, that he could, he could put a virtual background on,
[10:14] SPEAKER_01: with a crane on it, you know, he could give all kinds of lessons, you know, maybe not practical,
[10:21] SPEAKER_01: but theoretical lessons to people on their phones, at home on the tablet, and he's still thinking,
[10:28] SPEAKER_01: well, they were going to come into one room, and I bought you that. No, they don't. So I think, you
[10:32] SPEAKER_01: know, I mean, I'm a digital guy, but if you're not, one of the things to realize is really to look
[10:39] SPEAKER_01: at the tools that are there, and that over the last four years, they have just improved phenomenally.
[10:47] SPEAKER_01: I mean, zoom's not the number one performing text off, and I mean, performing upwards, not downwards,
[10:53] SPEAKER_01: on the markets for a reason, they have, they have the right pieces, it's not an effort for them.
[11:00] SPEAKER_01: So what I'm saying is, if you're going to work from home, look at the tools that you can use
[11:07] SPEAKER_01: to keep doing business, maybe in a little different way, maybe that's a bit of a hill for some
[11:13] SPEAKER_01: people to learn, but it certainly can, you know, you're never, you're never going to regret it,
[11:20] SPEAKER_01: because if you can do things this way, you can keep doing it in this way. So it doesn't,
[11:26] SPEAKER_01: there's no regression, it's a progression. So I think that's the work in from home thing that I
[11:32] SPEAKER_01: would say is to look at the way you've been working and look at a new tool set, home isolation,
[11:41] SPEAKER_01: it's not really isolation, you know, we're all online with each other all the time. So
[11:47] SPEAKER_01: yeah, we've been doing it forever, but it's not isolation. So that's what I would say.
[11:54] SPEAKER_00: Leandro, how about you? What are some of your favorite collaborative tools or online tools that help
[12:00] SPEAKER_02: with productivity? Yeah, for me, it's a, I'm going to go a little bit tactical. I've got two young
[12:05] SPEAKER_02: kids, so they're three years old and one year old, and for me, it's actually getting ahead of them.
[12:11] SPEAKER_02: So what I usually do is I wake up really early, 4am, 4.30, it was actually, I got going a little
[12:18] SPEAKER_02: bit late this morning, I got up at about 4.45, and by the time I, you know, started getting to
[12:25] SPEAKER_02: swing of things, it was half an hour later, but I usually like doing that. I just love the,
[12:31] SPEAKER_02: you know, the solitude in the morning, I feel that I wake up and I'm fresh, and I'm just good to go,
[12:37] SPEAKER_02: good to go, like ready to tackle on the world. And then I get some of my most important work done
[12:44] SPEAKER_02: at around that time, because I have about two hours of just like go, go, go. There's no distractions,
[12:51] SPEAKER_02: and then after that, obviously, you don't need to take care of the family as well, making sure that
[12:58] SPEAKER_02: you know, priorities are set for the day. One of the things that I really live in
[13:03] SPEAKER_02: is my calendar, right? On my mobile phone, it's on my laptop, and even then,
[13:09] SPEAKER_02: before what I usually do is, you know, I check off what I've done during the day, and then I kind
[13:14] SPEAKER_02: of prioritise what my day is going to be. So either I, you know, put it down on a, I have a little
[13:21] SPEAKER_02: notebook here actually that I have, and throughout the day, I just, compile my notes in here,
[13:26] SPEAKER_02: I review it at the end of the day, and then whatever it is, top of mind, or a priority, I put it
[13:32] SPEAKER_02: into my calendar the next day. So I kind of like automate things, you know, I'm not that smart,
[13:38] SPEAKER_02: right? But I tend to like use, you know, different things to really like help me out and keep
[13:44] SPEAKER_00: things top of mind. Well, I'd like to ask both of you a couple of questions. We normally ask our
[13:50] SPEAKER_00: guests, and then we'll wrap up today by talking a little bit about what Canada's podcast is going
[13:56] SPEAKER_00: to do in the weeks to come for the entrepreneurial community as Canada. But I'm curious, what are you
[14:03] SPEAKER_00: doing these days to help manage stress? I mean, I think none of us are immune from feeling the anxiety
[14:08] SPEAKER_00: of the changes that are happening so quickly around us. So what are you doing to minimise stress?
[14:15] SPEAKER_02: And Leandro, I'll start with you on this one. Cool, cool. So actually, yeah, that's a really good
[14:21] SPEAKER_02: question. Now that I'm kind of cooped up inside the house, I usually, I train pretty much every
[14:27] SPEAKER_02: day, seven days a week, and my training revolves around boxing. So I usually go out for runs, do my
[14:33] SPEAKER_02: conditioning, plyometric trails, isometrics. I go to the gym, do a little bit of weight or explosiveness.
[14:42] SPEAKER_02: But what I'm really missing is the actual boxing. And I feel that if I don't get that release,
[14:48] SPEAKER_02: it's kind of like my life giving sort. If I don't get that, you know, kind of my stress level
[14:52] SPEAKER_02: is the skyrocket. So being cooped up, I actually, I like staying active. So I go out for runs, especially
[15:01] SPEAKER_02: now that we're practicing social distancing. I pack the kids up into their double stroller,
[15:07] SPEAKER_02: and we go for a 5K, a 10K. Yesterday, I actually, I was so charged up. I think I did about 1100 pushups.
[15:16] SPEAKER_00: Wow.
[15:17] SPEAKER_01: You're good day. So you should point out that you do live in the country. So you can go for a run and
[15:22] SPEAKER_01: probably not see anybody. Exactly. And I've been a line-to-stay fit, everything. But for me,
[15:31] SPEAKER_01: when I'm stressed, I work, you know, work for me is, it's an awesome thing. I just love to do it.
[15:41] SPEAKER_01: And so if I'm stressed, I work my way through it. I create something, I write something, add up
[15:48] SPEAKER_01: projections, do that. I do something around that. Okay. Think of new ideas, just like we've been
[15:55] SPEAKER_01: talking about. I mean, think of that, that kind of thing. You know, if I can come out on the
[16:00] SPEAKER_01: positive side of that, even to start to be a breakthrough thing every time, just a positive side of it,
[16:06] SPEAKER_01: the stress just just cleared away. You know, if you love your work, then it's a positive
[16:13] SPEAKER_01: event like it's not stress, it's positive stress. Positive stress, read the book, is an awesome
[16:21] SPEAKER_01: thing. So if you do things with positivity, then stress, positive stress is a life-saving thing.
[16:33] SPEAKER_02: And when actually I go, yeah, feel something in there. If you love doing what you're doing,
[16:38] SPEAKER_00: it's not work, right? Absolutely. And I think it's really important, although we've been forced
[16:46] SPEAKER_00: to hit pause in a big way right now with some of our maybe planned activities for the quarter-one
[16:53] SPEAKER_00: and quarter-two, it's important to keep setting goals. This at some point will pass, and we will
[17:00] SPEAKER_00: have an opportunity to continue on in a different type of normal. But for me, what's really
[17:07] SPEAKER_00: helped over the last couple weeks in terms of mindset is to set some new goals and to map out, you know,
[17:14] SPEAKER_00: what I can do with this gift of time, to get myself on the path to achieving those things.
[17:20] SPEAKER_00: Well, the other question, I'm just wondering, do you have any books or podcasts or resources that
[17:25] SPEAKER_01: you'd like to recommend to the community? A couple of books, you know, that are really based on
[17:32] SPEAKER_01: interviews with others. So they're based on experiences of others. Once called Entrepreneur,
[17:38] SPEAKER_01: how to start an online business by Lucy Tobin, I think it's a really good book. And again,
[17:43] SPEAKER_01: very engaging interviews. So it's not using other people's words to help you resolve how to do that.
[17:52] SPEAKER_01: And a great one that I read a year ago, the $100 startup by Chris Gielibault, which is
[17:59] SPEAKER_01: actually, and again, it's using other people's knowledge so you can learn stuff. So I think those
[18:06] SPEAKER_01: are kind of very much relative to where we are today. Yeah, I'd like to add to that. I actually
[18:13] SPEAKER_02: have it right beside me. So this has been my companion for the last couple of weeks. It's called
[18:22] SPEAKER_02: as a student of philosophy. And I find that stoicism, especially in current prices or events
[18:29] SPEAKER_02: that you're experiencing today, has actually really helped me out. It kind of talks about, you know,
[18:35] SPEAKER_02: philosophy about, you know, meaning of life. How do you find true joy? How do you harness the
[18:41] SPEAKER_02: power of reason? Right? A lot of us are kind of like tunnel vision right now. We think that the
[18:46] SPEAKER_02: sky is falling. But if we take a look at just even the history of the human race, right? There's been
[18:52] SPEAKER_02: a lot of calamities. And I believe that philosophy, such as stoicism, has been with us through the
[18:59] SPEAKER_02: ages. It's been festive through time. And yeah, for people that may need a little bit of a pick
[19:06] SPEAKER_02: me up or just, you know, kind of a different perspective on things that would definitely,
[19:11] SPEAKER_02: yeah, recommend this book. It's called the Daily Stowage. There's one excerpt that
[19:17] SPEAKER_02: is a little bit less than or tidbit that you can read every single day for about a year. Awesome. Thank you.
[19:23] SPEAKER_00: Well, we've talked a little bit about just how we can bring the Canadian entrepreneurial community
[19:31] SPEAKER_00: together more than that. So, it's always been a focus in it, a priority for Canada's podcasts.
[19:37] SPEAKER_00: But so, maybe going forward, what do you hope that we can do and how we can serve the entrepreneurial
[19:42] SPEAKER_00: community in the weeks to come here as we navigate COVID-19 together?
[19:48] SPEAKER_01: Well, as I was going to say, the first thing is to realize that we are a community. And the reason
[19:54] SPEAKER_01: that we started Canada's podcast, Canada's entrepreneur, that without entrepreneurial focus, we felt
[20:01] SPEAKER_01: that really there wasn't a platform that was talking to entrepreneurs, all kinds of entrepreneurs
[20:09] SPEAKER_01: across the country. It tended to be, you know, the startup stuff, the tech stuff, the this stuff,
[20:15] SPEAKER_01: the that stuff. And we just wanted to talk to everybody. And, you know, we are the most
[20:22] SPEAKER_01: vibrant and I would say the most important community in the business community in the country.
[20:28] SPEAKER_01: I think, you know, you can sense that now because we're all, you know, on a stress level
[20:35] SPEAKER_01: in on shaking ground so that we employ a heck of a lot of the people and generate an incredible
[20:43] SPEAKER_01: amount of demand and revenue. So, I think, you know, we wanted to meet those people and connect them
[20:51] SPEAKER_01: with each other so that they could learn from each other. I think that will always be our mandate.
[20:57] SPEAKER_01: We have some very big ideas in the future, which I don't know whether one will roll out of
[21:03] SPEAKER_01: yeah. But it's working, you know, we're, we're glad Leandro can talk a little bit more about that.
[21:08] SPEAKER_01: But after 17 months, we have built a community. We are, we are definitely have a presence
[21:18] SPEAKER_01: in the country. You know, nobody knew about it is. We're getting all kinds of people in marketing,
[21:25] SPEAKER_01: PR, whatever, connecting with us, which means you know that. People are listening to us because
[21:31] SPEAKER_01: that they want us, they want their people on the show. So it is working and I think I can,
[21:39] SPEAKER_01: I can say to everybody, stay tuned because we have a lot of cool things for entrepreneurs that
[21:45] SPEAKER_01: will really build up the community and make it even stronger. I mean, we're absolutely committed
[21:51] SPEAKER_01: to doing that. I mean, I've been an entrepreneur for over 30 years. The last 18 months have been
[21:56] SPEAKER_01: super interesting in the sense that if you listen to this 250, 242, 250 interviews,
[22:04] SPEAKER_01: it's cool listen to the people are super interesting. And I like the diversity, which means
[22:11] SPEAKER_01: not everyone gives you the same solution. Some people came there doing it differently than others.
[22:17] SPEAKER_01: I, I'm a host, but I'm a listener as well. We're not going to stop profiling businesses and
[22:23] SPEAKER_00: stories during this time. And so it's an opportunity to tell more of those stories across the
[22:28] SPEAKER_01: country about what entrepreneurs are doing. Yeah, I mean, I interviewed the CEO of Waitepoint
[22:35] SPEAKER_01: a couple of days ago. I mean, the stunning fact of the matter is that he's there in Canada and the
[22:42] SPEAKER_01: US. The stunning fact of the matter is that his staff were doing, normally, do 200 R OEs a day,
[22:50] SPEAKER_01: that had increased already to $2,000 a day. So you get this interview,
[22:57] SPEAKER_01: oh my god, it's so close up. That's the reality of it. And that's kind of the stuff you get,
[23:04] SPEAKER_00: the information you get. Leandro, anything else that you would like to share before we
[23:10] SPEAKER_00: conclude our chat today, anything else you'd like to give our listeners a word on or?
[23:16] SPEAKER_02: Yeah, I'd like to just echo what Phil said, when we have been envisioning Canada's podcast and
[23:22] SPEAKER_02: Canada's entrepreneur, it is all about community. Especially in these tough times, I think,
[23:30] SPEAKER_02: community is what's going to get us through the hurdle, the challenge. I think the beauty too
[23:37] SPEAKER_02: about what has been done is that as we foster that community, we're also giving entrepreneurs
[23:43] SPEAKER_02: that individual voice, giving them that platform to tell their stories. And you know what,
[23:51] SPEAKER_02: not all of it is rosy and peachy. There's a lot of things in entrepreneurship that is really,
[23:58] SPEAKER_02: really hard. God, it reminds me of this book, hard things about hard things. It's only when you're
[24:06] SPEAKER_02: faced with that hard reality, will you be able to figure things out? There's nothing really
[24:13] SPEAKER_02: prebuilt out there that can get you through adversity. So I think that we're really proud of what
[24:20] SPEAKER_02: we've done with Canada's entrepreneur and the stories that we were able to bring our audience.
[24:26] SPEAKER_02: And as Phil has mentioned in the next coming months, there's going to be a lot of really new and
[24:33] SPEAKER_02: exciting stuff around that. But at the end of the day, it is still going to center around
[24:37] SPEAKER_02: community and it will still center around the entrepreneur and the stories that they bring.
[24:44] SPEAKER_00: And there will be some incredible and inspiring stories that come out of this time that we're in.
[24:50] SPEAKER_00: So, yeah, well, thank you both. It's been so much fun to chat with you today. And I think everyone
[24:58] SPEAKER_00: who's tuned in to listen and I encourage you to keep checking back. As both Phil and Leandro have
[25:04] SPEAKER_00: said, we have many exciting things to share with you in the weeks to come. Thanks for listening.
[25:10] SPEAKER_01: Thank you. Thank you all.