============================================================
TRANSCRIPTION WITH SPEAKERS
============================================================
[00:00] SPEAKER_05: Welcome to Canada's podcast.
[00:05] SPEAKER_05: Hello and welcome to Calgary's podcast with Mario Tonoguzzi on Canada's podcast network.
[00:12] SPEAKER_05: Joining me today is André Salazar, Zach Tambasco and Guillermo Borges, who basically run
[00:22] SPEAKER_05: Alpav vertical farms in Calgary. Thanks, Jens, for joining us today.
[00:27] SPEAKER_05: Thank you guys for having us. Mario, thank you.
[00:30] SPEAKER_05: All right, let me just start by asking you and then anybody can jump in and just tell me what Alpav vertical farms is and what you guys do.
[00:41] SPEAKER_00: Yeah, I can take that one Mario. Basically, we want to be the best microgreen company not just in Calgary, but in Canada.
[00:50] SPEAKER_00: And yeah, that is at the very core of everything we do.
[00:55] SPEAKER_00: So we grow our product with very local initiatives, our seeds are Canadian, they're non-GMO and organic certified, the packages are Canadian.
[01:04] SPEAKER_00: And that ties into our charitable initiatives.
[01:07] SPEAKER_00: Every package has a donation built into it. And what that means is after we cover our costs, 5% of everything we make goes to charities and we actually let our followers choose.
[01:18] SPEAKER_00: So on our Instagram, we hold a poll and we'll usually have two charities and we have it that way because it's transparent.
[01:25] SPEAKER_00: We don't want to be making that call. We want to let our community choose what charities were supporting.
[01:30] SPEAKER_00: So we're just providing them a voice and just executing on what they want to do.
[01:37] SPEAKER_00: But we're also very focused on technology and that's really one of the biggest things for us.
[01:42] SPEAKER_00: We looked at the microgreen space and Andre can tell you more about this later.
[01:47] SPEAKER_00: But we looked at the microgreen space and saw that there was a gap.
[01:51] SPEAKER_00: We think that there's more that can be done.
[01:54] SPEAKER_00: And we looked at agriculture in general and thought, okay, there's farming equipment, sure.
[01:59] SPEAKER_00: But what's really being done to grow and push the technology of growing?
[02:05] SPEAKER_00: And yeah, there was a gap there and we thought maybe we could fill it.
[02:08] SPEAKER_00: So that's how this company started and so far it's gone pretty good.
[02:11] SPEAKER_00: What do you guys grow?
[02:14] SPEAKER_00: So far we have four products. It's mostly microgreens, but you know, we're looking at expanding beyond that in the future.
[02:20] SPEAKER_00: But yeah, right now we have a root uva, broccoli, radish and sunflower microgreens, each with its own benefits and trade offs.
[02:30] SPEAKER_00: And we're looking at putting out two products towards Q3, Q4 of 2021.
[02:37] SPEAKER_05: Oh, okay, then. Can you tell me a little bit about the history of how you guys started and why you started and when?
[02:45] SPEAKER_01: Yeah, sure. So, so I'm Andre. I'm the, I'm the guy with the initial idea.
[02:53] SPEAKER_01: Basically, I'm an engineer by trade.
[02:56] SPEAKER_01: And I'm also, I have an experience as being a farmer as well. I'm from Columbia.
[03:01] SPEAKER_01: So I came here to Canada when I was 14. I said refugee.
[03:07] SPEAKER_01: And one day, I was wondering what I can contribute to society.
[03:12] SPEAKER_01: And one of the things that I'm passionate about is science and technology.
[03:16] SPEAKER_01: And in turns out, there was a gap. As Guillermo said, there was a gap in agriculture.
[03:20] SPEAKER_01: It needs a little bit of an upgrade.
[03:23] SPEAKER_01: And so I put it together my experience as a farmer and in my practical skills as an engineer.
[03:33] SPEAKER_01: And yeah, I came up with this idea and then I actually admit this guy's at Loes working at Loes.
[03:40] SPEAKER_01: So I brought up the idea and Guillermo was more in the business side.
[03:45] SPEAKER_01: So that was something that I was lacking on.
[03:46] SPEAKER_01: I had the engineer, the science down.
[03:50] SPEAKER_01: But, but he was more the business guy. So I told him how, you know, I wanted to do this thing.
[03:56] SPEAKER_01: But I didn't know how to bring it to life to reality.
[04:00] SPEAKER_01: And so, you know, he jumped in and helped me.
[04:03] SPEAKER_01: Zach as well. Zach has, you know, some experience as being a farmer as well.
[04:09] SPEAKER_01: He jumped in. He also knows how to well. That's another thing.
[04:12] SPEAKER_01: We made these things ourselves. So back then I was starting to learn how to well.
[04:20] SPEAKER_01: And Zach jumped in and he's like, you know what? I know a little bit about welding.
[04:24] SPEAKER_01: And so we started playing around. And yeah, the three of us somehow met up and decided to start this.
[04:30] SPEAKER_01: So, what started at Loes?
[04:32] SPEAKER_01: What year was this?
[04:35] SPEAKER_00: Late 2019, I believe.
[04:37] SPEAKER_00: It made nearly 2019.
[04:39] SPEAKER_05: Okay. So all three of you were at Loes.
[04:43] SPEAKER_05: Were you in university or that number?
[04:47] SPEAKER_00: Yeah. So at the time, Andre was in physics at UFC.
[04:51] SPEAKER_00: And I was at Mount Royal.
[04:53] SPEAKER_00: I was doing a major in marketing with a minor in innovation and entrepreneurship.
[04:57] SPEAKER_00: So it kind of worked really well.
[05:00] SPEAKER_02: And Zach, what were you taken?
[05:02] SPEAKER_02: For me, I went to Mount Royal a little bit after.
[05:04] SPEAKER_02: But I actually moved here in 2018 and I met these guys.
[05:09] SPEAKER_02: And that's kind of how we were starting it.
[05:12] SPEAKER_02: But I did take courses to get into business.
[05:14] SPEAKER_02: And then prior, I was at Nate to get into welding.
[05:18] SPEAKER_02: That's where the background for that comes.
[05:20] SPEAKER_05: And where are you from, Zach?
[05:23] SPEAKER_02: From Edmonton, Alberta. I was born there and I lived a little bit east in Sher Park on a farm.
[05:29] SPEAKER_05: Okay. Secret. And Guillermo, where's your origins and nationality?
[05:35] SPEAKER_00: Yeah, I'm originally from Venezuela.
[05:37] SPEAKER_00: So I came Canada in 2014.
[05:40] SPEAKER_00: Wow.
[05:43] SPEAKER_05: Tell me a little bit about these.
[05:46] SPEAKER_05: This industry itself.
[05:49] SPEAKER_05: And why you think it's.
[05:52] SPEAKER_05: I guess a growing area in the country.
[05:55] SPEAKER_05: Consumers are looking for this type of stuff.
[05:58] SPEAKER_01: Yeah. So I believe I would definitely see a gap there.
[06:03] SPEAKER_01: And that needs to be felt.
[06:04] SPEAKER_01: And people are willing to support farms are more environmentally focused.
[06:10] SPEAKER_01: And they're able to grow and create jobs as well.
[06:14] SPEAKER_01: On the meantime.
[06:15] SPEAKER_01: And yeah, so we see at this this movement to more local growing food.
[06:21] SPEAKER_01: And this demand for for for more local businesses, right?
[06:26] SPEAKER_01: So especially because of COVID.
[06:28] SPEAKER_01: We also seen that the farming industry as it is right now is not sustainable, not only environmentally, but economically as well.
[06:37] SPEAKER_01: So you see all these migrants coming into the country to fulfill this jobs that Canadians don't want to do.
[06:45] SPEAKER_01: And I think that's that's a huge issue.
[06:47] SPEAKER_01: And so if we're able to combine those.
[06:52] SPEAKER_01: You know, created technology that is able to grow these plants in such an economically way, we can also create the jobs and the freshness that people are looking for as well.
[07:04] SPEAKER_00: So we go ahead.
[07:06] SPEAKER_00: Just to add a little bit to that, I saw something that we saw as a real opportunity is not people are looking for local.
[07:16] SPEAKER_00: And especially in the wake of COVID that became really apparent.
[07:20] SPEAKER_00: Like you can there's so much exposure.
[07:23] SPEAKER_00: But also we saw an opportunity to kind of transcend what it meant to be like a food company.
[07:29] SPEAKER_00: And we looked at it as, you know, why not have a bigger overarching impact?
[07:33] SPEAKER_00: Like often people can tell you what brand are the latest or their carrots are.
[07:37] SPEAKER_00: It's almost like a commodity.
[07:40] SPEAKER_00: We wanted to make it a brand and make it something that people can resonate and identify with and go, you know, this is a product that I feel good about.
[07:48] SPEAKER_00: So that's where we also saw an opportunity from a business marketing standpoint where it just wasn't being done in the industry.
[07:56] SPEAKER_00: Now there's been a little bit more of that.
[07:59] SPEAKER_00: But we still think there's massive opportunities to be taken.
[08:01] SPEAKER_05: And where does the stuff get grown? Like where do you harvest everything?
[08:09] SPEAKER_00: I think our head of production can tell you a little bit about that.
[08:12] SPEAKER_02: Yeah, basically we have a warehouse of over 1200 square feet and we have machines essentially that that grow it.
[08:21] SPEAKER_02: So we have to monitor it to everything.
[08:23] SPEAKER_02: And yeah, that's kind of.
[08:25] SPEAKER_02: We it's just a little bit east into a Calgary.
[08:29] SPEAKER_05: Okay, you know what I find is interesting because recently, apparently recently I did a story on sobies have those vertical farms in many of their stores.
[08:44] SPEAKER_05: And so you're seeing a lot of a lot of that trend going on.
[08:50] SPEAKER_05: And we're speaking of stores where do you sell the stuff?
[08:55] SPEAKER_00: Yeah, so as of right now we're at four centeras, all the ones in Calgary, including one in red deer.
[09:01] SPEAKER_00: Okay.
[09:02] SPEAKER_00: As well as the Italian Center during Calgary.
[09:05] SPEAKER_00: Beautiful.
[09:06] SPEAKER_05: Next time I drop in there for some cold cuts and some buns, I'll check it out.
[09:16] SPEAKER_05: The name itself, maybe someone could describe how the name came about.
[09:23] SPEAKER_05: The all pa what is all pa stand for?
[09:27] SPEAKER_01: Yeah, so, sorry, I can say that.
[09:29] SPEAKER_01: Yeah, so all plays the goddess in the Inca culture.
[09:36] SPEAKER_01: She supposed to be the goddess of fertility.
[09:40] SPEAKER_01: And so the Inca is used to pray to this goddess for a better harvest, you know, very first-poil harvest.
[09:48] SPEAKER_01: And you know, the Inca is used to also have aquaponics.
[09:52] SPEAKER_01: So they used to grow their vegetables in water.
[09:56] SPEAKER_01: But you know, with fish as well.
[09:58] SPEAKER_01: So we obviously do it differently, just with water, not fish.
[10:02] SPEAKER_01: But I always found that interesting that they figure that out, you know, having, you know, the fish helping to grow these vegetables in water.
[10:10] SPEAKER_01: That was really cool.
[10:12] SPEAKER_01: Yeah, so that's how the name came about.
[10:15] SPEAKER_00: And it's kind of a funny thing because with the way we do things, there's only to pray for a fruitful harvest.
[10:24] SPEAKER_00: Guaranteed 365, no matter the weather.
[10:28] SPEAKER_00: So that's another thing that, you know, we think is unique about vertical farming or technology supported farming where, you know, you're not relying on the weather, you're not relying on the rain, you don't, you know, it's very, very controlled.
[10:42] SPEAKER_00: And you think there's going to be a need for a lot more of that in the future.
[10:46] SPEAKER_05: Okay, so you guys are all fairly young.
[10:49] SPEAKER_05: I'm taking you're probably in your mid-twenties or so.
[10:54] SPEAKER_05: Yeah.
[10:55] SPEAKER_05: So what's it like to be an entrepreneur?
[10:59] SPEAKER_05: Like what do you like most about being an entrepreneur?
[11:05] SPEAKER_00: For me, it's the problem solving.
[11:09] SPEAKER_00: Obviously, there's stress and, you know, a bunch of other things that come with that.
[11:13] SPEAKER_00: But for me, I like the reward after you fix an issue.
[11:18] SPEAKER_00: So for example, recently we had a bit of a breakthrough where we increased airflow to one of our crops and the yields went up like 30%.
[11:29] SPEAKER_00: So things like that, for me, are very rewarding because it feels like we're pushing the envelope on what can be done.
[11:36] SPEAKER_03: Yeah.
[11:37] SPEAKER_00: And we're constantly improving.
[11:40] SPEAKER_00: That's one of my favorite things.
[11:41] SPEAKER_05: How about you guys Zach and Andre?
[11:45] SPEAKER_02: Yeah, I like the, we have a kind of, it's exciting for it to have a new kind of product and have the local kind of initiative to it.
[11:55] SPEAKER_02: And I think it's awesome because we get so much recognition from people and they enjoy it.
[12:00] SPEAKER_02: And that's rewarding for me too.
[12:02] SPEAKER_02: Oh, yeah, we buy stuff all the time.
[12:04] SPEAKER_02: It's like, thank you so much.
[12:05] SPEAKER_02: It's incredible.
[12:06] SPEAKER_01: So, yeah, for me, it's like, you know, it's kind of tough to put it into words, but it's not like the mission.
[12:16] SPEAKER_01: You know, it's having to do things different, to bring product that it's unique.
[12:24] SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
[12:24] SPEAKER_01: It's just better in everywhere.
[12:27] SPEAKER_01: It's not just helping me.
[12:28] SPEAKER_01: It's also helping the community.
[12:31] SPEAKER_01: I feel like entrepreneurs are misunderstood as just like trying to make money and greedy.
[12:38] SPEAKER_01: That's not necessarily the case, you know, someone has actually want to add value to the industry.
[12:46] SPEAKER_01: And I think that's exactly what we're doing is we have a mission.
[12:50] SPEAKER_01: And that's what gets me up every morning.
[12:52] SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
[12:52] SPEAKER_01: I'm working hard and working those long hours.
[12:54] SPEAKER_01: It's having a mission in that being, having something different that you know that, you know, all the farms are not doing.
[13:00] SPEAKER_01: Or, you know, that you're pushing yourself and the industry to the edge of what's possible.
[13:07] SPEAKER_05: So, I'm just curious, going back to what you guys do.
[13:12] SPEAKER_05: Why did you come up with this concept of the donation with the sales?
[13:18] SPEAKER_00: Why is that important to you guys?
[13:20] SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
[13:21] SPEAKER_00: So, when we first talked about it, one of the first things that Andre said was like, look, I just want to help out.
[13:28] SPEAKER_00: And I'm like, okay, that's awesome. How are we going to do it?
[13:33] SPEAKER_00: So, we kind of looked at what we thought were some of the best brands in the world.
[13:36] SPEAKER_00: So, we looked at brands like Tom's.
[13:40] SPEAKER_00: We looked at, you know, all the certified B companies that, like Andre said, are, are, yes, obviously they're making money and they're making profit.
[13:48] SPEAKER_00: But that's how, like that's what enables them to help.
[13:52] SPEAKER_00: So, we wanted to show that there's a real opportunity to look at farming as a profitable business.
[14:01] SPEAKER_00: Because a lot of people are agents that can test to this being from show at park.
[14:05] SPEAKER_00: They look at farming as like what their grandpa used to do.
[14:08] SPEAKER_00: And everybody wants to move to the city now and get an office job or whatever it may be.
[14:13] SPEAKER_00: So, we wanted to find a way to help ourselves out while helping out the community and painting this industry in a new light.
[14:23] SPEAKER_00: Like, you know, for a lot of people, vegetables aren't sexy.
[14:26] SPEAKER_00: We're trying to make that difference and say, hey, you know, there's a little bit more to this than you might think.
[14:31] SPEAKER_00: I don't know. Rugal is pretty sexy.
[14:34] SPEAKER_00: It is.
[14:35] SPEAKER_00: Especially in the background.
[14:36] SPEAKER_00: It's a good.
[14:40] SPEAKER_05: I was just curious.
[14:41] SPEAKER_05: What made you choose those four initial items, I guess, to grow?
[14:48] SPEAKER_01: Well, in the beginning, I was doing lots of trials, lots of microbeans.
[14:52] SPEAKER_01: And it turns out those were like the easy ones to grow.
[14:56] SPEAKER_01: And also they have this thing taste.
[15:00] SPEAKER_01: So they're all very different to each other.
[15:03] SPEAKER_01: You know, you have the spicy one, the pepper you want, like the raya, the spicy one like radish.
[15:09] SPEAKER_01: And the one that's like lettuce, like sunflower, you know.
[15:12] SPEAKER_01: And then you get your broccoli, kind of like the broccoli sprouts that you usually buy in stores.
[15:17] SPEAKER_01: So I thought those were really interesting.
[15:19] SPEAKER_01: And they were also really easy to grow.
[15:22] SPEAKER_01: And I could run trials on them, right?
[15:25] SPEAKER_01: So the technology that I was developing required crops that were quickly grown so that I can adjust.
[15:33] SPEAKER_01: Do adjustments as I go.
[15:35] SPEAKER_01: To iterate the process, those crops were sort of like the easy ones.
[15:41] SPEAKER_01: And people really liked them too as well.
[15:44] SPEAKER_01: People really liked the sunflower.
[15:48] SPEAKER_05: Okay, I'll put in my request that you guys start growing or radicchio.
[15:53] SPEAKER_01: Okay, radicchio.
[15:56] SPEAKER_01: We got a lot of questions.
[15:57] SPEAKER_01: We have a friend of ours that wants us to grow garlic.
[16:00] SPEAKER_01: Garlic, yeah.
[16:01] SPEAKER_01: Oh, well.
[16:03] SPEAKER_01: As a little stretch right now.
[16:05] SPEAKER_01: Yeah, but we're experimenting.
[16:08] SPEAKER_00: We can't say too much, but maybe by the time this is out, the products will be out too.
[16:14] SPEAKER_00: So what's the turnover in terms of the cycle for growing?
[16:19] SPEAKER_03: On average, about 13 days from seat to package.
[16:24] SPEAKER_03: From seat to package of 13 days?
[16:28] SPEAKER_03: Absolutely.
[16:28] SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
[16:30] SPEAKER_00: So, so that's one of the,
[16:31] SPEAKER_05: I think Maya Rugal is going to take a little longer to grow.
[16:34] SPEAKER_00: Yeah, and that's one of the beauties of microgreens and other reasons we've focused on this.
[16:40] SPEAKER_00: As Andrea alluded to, you can iterate really quickly.
[16:44] SPEAKER_00: So if you're getting started and you don't know, for example,
[16:47] SPEAKER_00: how much water to put on them,
[16:49] SPEAKER_00: you can grow four of them at the same time.
[16:51] SPEAKER_00: And within two weeks, you'll know.
[16:53] SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
[16:54] SPEAKER_00: So, yeah.
[16:55] SPEAKER_00: And that adds to the sustainability thing.
[16:58] SPEAKER_00: You know, we use 99% less water than a regular reds that will be because they grow so quickly that the water you're putting on them,
[17:06] SPEAKER_00: which is very little,
[17:07] SPEAKER_00: it gets absorbed all by the microgreens.
[17:10] SPEAKER_00: And that's it.
[17:10] SPEAKER_00: You don't need to over water.
[17:12] SPEAKER_00: It's very, very efficient from that perspective.
[17:15] SPEAKER_05: Okay.
[17:15] SPEAKER_05: So when you say microgreens,
[17:19] SPEAKER_05: just to explain to people,
[17:20] SPEAKER_05: what does that really mean?
[17:23] SPEAKER_05: Yeah.
[17:24] SPEAKER_01: So I guess the best way to explain it will be between the sprout stage of the plant and the baby stage when it has the true leaf.
[17:37] SPEAKER_01: So we are right in the middle between the sprout stage and the baby stage.
[17:42] SPEAKER_01: You know, it's at a point where it doesn't taste like a sprout.
[17:45] SPEAKER_01: It actually has a taste like the full grown plant.
[17:48] SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
[17:49] SPEAKER_01: Yeah, it will be grown, but it's really strong because it's almost getting to the baby stage.
[17:55] SPEAKER_01: So yeah, so that's basically what it is.
[17:58] SPEAKER_01: It's a stage in the plant growth.
[18:01] SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
[18:01] SPEAKER_02: I like to tell people it's a smaller version of the bigger vegetable.
[18:04] Speaker UNKNOWN: Yeah.
[18:05] SPEAKER_00: It's very fragile.
[18:08] SPEAKER_00: Like if you wait three or four more days, you're past it.
[18:11] SPEAKER_00: And it's also the point at which they're most nutrient-thense,
[18:14] SPEAKER_00: which is obviously very valuable to anybody that's eating it.
[18:19] SPEAKER_00: So did you guys as kids growing up eat your greens?
[18:23] SPEAKER_00: No, I didn't.
[18:24] SPEAKER_00: I didn't know.
[18:25] SPEAKER_00: I didn't know.
[18:26] Speaker UNKNOWN: I didn't know.
[18:26] SPEAKER_00: Bit of a struggle.
[18:28] SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
[18:29] SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
[18:30] SPEAKER_00: That's changed, obviously.
[18:33] SPEAKER_00: But no, I used to hate it.
[18:35] SPEAKER_00: I used to be like, no, I don't get that stuff away from you.
[18:39] SPEAKER_02: Basically for me as well, it was spinach.
[18:41] SPEAKER_02: I love spinach.
[18:41] SPEAKER_02: I don't know why, but it was like the one thing I could kind of consistently eat.
[18:44] SPEAKER_01: So for me, it was fruits.
[18:46] SPEAKER_01: Right.
[18:46] SPEAKER_01: I was always around fruit like banana, as mangoes and all the stuff.
[18:50] SPEAKER_01: So it was lucky.
[18:54] SPEAKER_05: All right, well, gentlemen, thank you.
[18:56] SPEAKER_05: It's been an absolute pleasure talking to you guys today.
[19:01] SPEAKER_05: Awesome.
[19:02] Speaker UNKNOWN: Thank you.
[19:02] SPEAKER_02: Thank you.
[19:04] SPEAKER_05: I'll try not to put your names, but that was Andre Salazar,
[19:09] SPEAKER_05: Zach Tampasco and Guillermo Borges, who are the operators of all political farms in
[19:17] SPEAKER_05: Calgary.
[19:18] SPEAKER_05: This has been Calgary's podcast with Mario Toneguzi on Canada's podcast network.
[19:23] SPEAKER_05: Thanks for joining us today.
