============================================================
TRANSCRIPTION WITH SPEAKERS
============================================================
[00:00] SPEAKER_00: Welcome to Canada's Entrepreneur, where we talk to the entrepreneurs who are making it happen
[00:05] SPEAKER_00: across Canada and deliver the news, trends, knowledge and opinions from entrepreneurs and business
[00:13] SPEAKER_00: influences across the country. Hello, I'm Mario Tanaguzi, managing editor of Canada's Entrepreneur.
[00:22] SPEAKER_01: Joining me today on Calgary's podcast is Chris Kerr, who is president and founder of XA
[00:29] SPEAKER_01: Security. Thanks Chris for joining us today. Thanks for having me. Okay, let's just talk a little
[00:36] SPEAKER_01: bit first of all Chris about XA Security. Tell me a little bit about what it is and what it does.
[00:43] SPEAKER_02: Well at our core we're a security guard company. We're 21 years old. We're based in Calgary and
[00:49] SPEAKER_02: have a branch in Edmonton. So I'll party base. We have interesting routes. Our routes are in
[00:56] SPEAKER_02: entertainment and so we were born in the concert and and a music festival business and over the
[01:04] SPEAKER_02: years, I've transitioned into a broader platform of security guard services. Well tell me
[01:09] SPEAKER_01: beyond the music here right now, what kind of venues do you do security for? We do all sorts. We do
[01:16] SPEAKER_02: commercial, residential, construction development. Obviously still entertainment is a big part of
[01:24] SPEAKER_02: what we do. But yeah largely we're seeing a lot of growth and a lot of interest in the construction
[01:32] SPEAKER_02: space in particular, especially in Calgary. Lots going on. And multifamily residential is a very
[01:40] SPEAKER_01: popular spot for us these days. You do a much retail. The reason I ask is because I go
[01:45] SPEAKER_01: went to malls these days and I see certain places have a security guard at the door where
[01:52] SPEAKER_02: the past and never what have had one. Well it's a space we'd love to get into and we don't do a
[01:59] SPEAKER_02: lot of retail and you know and and perhaps that's a bit of a lead in into the into the why which is
[02:06] SPEAKER_02: you know, COVID changed us a lot and we were an entertainment business prior to COVID and became
[02:12] SPEAKER_02: a more broad security business with more of an entertainment business unit after COVID. So
[02:20] SPEAKER_02: it's interesting because as much as we're 21 years old I often say we're five in a lot of these
[02:27] SPEAKER_02: markets right and so retail is something that is on our roadmap for sure. We think you know the
[02:35] SPEAKER_02: kind of skill set our team is developed and dealing with people over the years would be great
[02:40] SPEAKER_02: alignments there. But yeah, I often look and wonder what else can we do I'd like to do it all but
[02:47] SPEAKER_02: there's only so many hours in a day so we kind of follow the path that that we're on and
[02:53] SPEAKER_01: get to that in a strategic way is the goal. So tell me how this all came about like you know what
[03:00] SPEAKER_02: generated this idea to do this? Well I was going to school at the University of Calgary and
[03:07] SPEAKER_02: I was kind of meattering my way around different majors trying to figure out what to do with my life
[03:12] SPEAKER_02: at the young age of 17 when I started and I found my way to the student union and so I became
[03:19] SPEAKER_02: involved with student politics there and and specifically served on the events portfolio so I
[03:25] SPEAKER_02: discovered concerts through going to school and being a part of McEwen Hall here at the UFC which
[03:32] SPEAKER_02: produced a number of really well-known shows back then and it was just one thing that led to
[03:38] SPEAKER_02: another I found myself being more active on this staff end of the shows and and we had a
[03:46] SPEAKER_02: challenge with some supplier and vendor kind of fulfillment and we started as a stagehand
[03:53] SPEAKER_02: business in solving a problem to you know get the number of people we needed to help build our
[04:00] SPEAKER_02: shows and then a year later we got into security and and kind of looked at it and said well we're
[04:07] SPEAKER_02: managing these shows from an organizational standpoint and we weren't really thrilled with the
[04:15] SPEAKER_02: options and and kind of the behavior of security at the time it was very kind of nightclub
[04:21] SPEAKER_02: bouncer big kind of inspired and and so as a student kind of Paul you know leader at the time I
[04:33] SPEAKER_02: said well there's got to be a better way to kind of treat the students that are the primary
[04:37] SPEAKER_02: customer of this show and and not seeing many options a couple guys and I took matters into our
[04:43] SPEAKER_02: own hands and decided to get into the security business ourselves so we could build the team
[04:48] SPEAKER_02: that would treat our you know our fans the way that we wanted them to be treated and that was
[04:52] SPEAKER_01: ultimately the impetus of the company so a couple of just I have a curiosity questions I'm curious
[05:00] SPEAKER_01: what was the biggest music event that you've served security on when you've been around so
[05:07] SPEAKER_02: if you've lived in Calgary or Edmonton you have likely seen our yellow shirts and we've probably
[05:12] SPEAKER_02: searched you going into something we've worked on most of the major events in the province for
[05:19] SPEAKER_02: the last 20 years and I've been lucky to have most of the major players as as our clients biggest shows
[05:27] SPEAKER_02: we've done gosh we've done the the queen when she visited the rolling stones we've done worked on
[05:35] SPEAKER_02: big valley jamboree music festivals like chasing summary the Calgary stampede all sorts of things
[05:42] SPEAKER_02: wow we've we've literally we've probably admitted over a million two million people through the
[05:50] SPEAKER_01: gates over those 20 years I would say well so tell me if can you recall like like one particular
[05:58] SPEAKER_01: incident that was kind of the quote-unquote worst incident that you had to deal with at any of the
[06:05] SPEAKER_02: events yeah the thing about events is that they're temporary small towns right and depending on
[06:14] SPEAKER_02: the size of the event yeah the the incidents scale right so when we do a festival say a 30,000
[06:23] SPEAKER_02: person event or 50,000 person men that's the equivalent of a 50,000 person town you have people
[06:28] SPEAKER_02: meet you know their future partners they break up they get injured they have heart attacks they
[06:34] SPEAKER_02: get in fights they over consume they do too many drugs so there can be weather events there can
[06:41] SPEAKER_02: be external threats there's just a myriad of things that can combine and converge on on these days
[06:47] SPEAKER_02: so we've seen lots over those years our team was notably providing security services in the
[06:55] SPEAKER_02: outer perimeter of the big valley jamboree in 2009 when the storm took the stage down that year and
[07:00] SPEAKER_02: so I think that was a really the catalyst moment for us to shift our thinking from being more
[07:09] SPEAKER_02: of a hey we're having a good time we're doing events and we we get to do this and this is fun too
[07:15] SPEAKER_02: oh this is also really very real and and has high consequence uh uh you know in moments like that so
[07:23] SPEAKER_02: that that one was certainly memorable among among others before I forget what what is XA stand for
[07:30] SPEAKER_02: I stand for experience ambassadors okay and we look at ourselves as ambassadors the experiences
[07:37] SPEAKER_02: whether that's our fans or our clients and when people hire us they're they're they're looking
[07:44] SPEAKER_02: for us to represent their place right so when we when we're providing security services out of
[07:50] SPEAKER_02: any let's you know just say it's the standpede for for example people don't call us the complain they
[07:57] SPEAKER_02: don't typically dig deep to figure out who the vendor is they will light up the standpede so we've
[08:03] SPEAKER_02: we've always we've always looked at it like we wear the badge of of the people that we represent and so
[08:09] SPEAKER_02: we're their ambassadors and it's important to us that you know we we honor that so that's
[08:14] SPEAKER_01: what the name came from yeah I'm also curious about uh um you know when you're looking at an event
[08:22] SPEAKER_01: that's got thousands thousands of people as you mentioned how much planning goes into each event
[08:29] SPEAKER_01: like like when you start first of all when you start planning for an event and how long do you think
[08:35] SPEAKER_02: it takes just for the actual planning part of it well I will go over the 20 years of doing this I've
[08:42] SPEAKER_02: warned two hats and so you know I joke that that the early you know decade of the business we really
[08:47] SPEAKER_02: ran it off the side of the deck my desk because the two partners I founded it with back then
[08:53] SPEAKER_02: owned a concert company they were promoters and I worked for them so I've I have a career as an
[08:58] SPEAKER_02: event producer and so to answer that question is complex it's anywhere from a day to years right
[09:06] SPEAKER_02: depending on the size of the event and so there are some events that have full time staff that they
[09:13] SPEAKER_02: work on one event that spans you know two to seven ten days a year and but I would say you know
[09:20] SPEAKER_02: when you're working on on the concert a typical ticketed event side of things those things are
[09:25] SPEAKER_02: planned typically about a year out yeah on average you know what artists decide when they're going to
[09:31] SPEAKER_02: route a tour and when they decide they want to be out and then promoters find time to get venue
[09:38] SPEAKER_02: dates and you know hockey seasons need to be figured out before you can lock in dates and all that
[09:44] SPEAKER_02: kind of stuff right so you typically start about a year out and then it really ramps up in the
[09:48] SPEAKER_02: three months so you typically attend a lot of the events yourself I've been to many many events
[09:56] SPEAKER_02: yes in my life I try to get out as much as I can but you know the team is pretty big and we
[10:04] SPEAKER_02: handle a lot of events these days but it's I do try to get a couple times a month at least for sure
[10:10] SPEAKER_01: what is the biggest thing from your standpoint that's changed say in the 20 odd years there
[10:17] SPEAKER_01: in terms of security there's been something that stands out that's been the biggest change from
[10:24] SPEAKER_02: when you first started I think that the the industry has evolved and I think that technology has
[10:34] SPEAKER_02: really started to step up as far as participating in this 20 years ago when we got started it was
[10:41] SPEAKER_02: very much a game of numbers of people looking out for positions camera technology was very expensive
[10:47] SPEAKER_02: to deploy at the time and so we've seen a real evolution now in the security space both both
[10:52] SPEAKER_02: in entertainment and in you know static and mobile security is the advancement of technology and
[10:59] SPEAKER_02: the ability to leverage AI analytics and real-time notifications have really enabled people to
[11:06] SPEAKER_02: do a lot more with less and so it's changed the security guard business I think quite a bit in
[11:12] SPEAKER_02: the sense where you know if the old sales pitch was hey you got a you know a two acre site and
[11:18] SPEAKER_02: you need this many people 24 hours a day it's now we could probably do that with one if you have
[11:24] SPEAKER_02: strategic cameras and and really good AI notification setup and and where where can we integrate
[11:31] SPEAKER_02: tightly in that system so we get those notifications immediately so all that's changing the the old days
[11:39] SPEAKER_02: of monitoring stations and people watching eight screens at a time are now AI and the notifications
[11:47] SPEAKER_02: are instantaneous and so the evolution for us is to figure out I think where the humans still fit
[11:54] SPEAKER_02: into that because people are still a big part of the equation for the foreseeable future that decades
[12:01] SPEAKER_02: but it's changing with how much how much humans do need to be involved so it's it's an interesting
[12:07] SPEAKER_01: time in security okay so the the stereotype the the typical a perception that someone would have
[12:15] SPEAKER_01: of a security guard big muscular guy tell me what you guys look for it in security guards today
[12:23] SPEAKER_02: well sometimes you do need that sometimes you you you need the higher skill set and the training
[12:29] SPEAKER_02: and the physical strength to do certain tasks or sure but typically what we see in the
[12:37] SPEAKER_02: security guard market where it's customer facing or more retail residential level is is people that
[12:48] SPEAKER_02: can get cooperation from others and so if I look back on where we started the business and where
[12:54] SPEAKER_02: I think we were really successful is identifying that the best people to manage answered people are
[13:02] SPEAKER_02: other people that like going to concerts and understand how concerts work and so on that on that
[13:08] SPEAKER_02: idea we looked for lifeguards and teachers and we really built the that part of the business
[13:16] SPEAKER_02: as the come work for us for your vacation fund not your full-time job and what we found is we
[13:21] SPEAKER_02: we got a really interesting subset of people that had a vast skill set in background and it was
[13:29] SPEAKER_02: incredible and so we try now to to mirror that in the property and the construction and that sort
[13:36] SPEAKER_02: of space and we're looking for people that have experience in those spaces that understand how
[13:42] SPEAKER_02: construction site works that know the nuances of those things that can be helpful at those sites and
[13:49] SPEAKER_02: and have some baseline of safety understanding and that kind of thing so we're always trying to find
[13:55] SPEAKER_02: people that have some parallel experience in the space that we're trying to put them in.
[14:01] SPEAKER_02: Roughly how many security guards do you have? The roster is a little over 700 right now.
[14:09] SPEAKER_01: Changes regularly. Wow. Wow. And I'm just curious about your thoughts about security in general.
[14:18] SPEAKER_01: You know I mentioned earlier you know about running into a council of security guards at the front door
[14:24] SPEAKER_01: of certain retailers. At my correct and saying we're seeing more security guards in all facets
[14:33] SPEAKER_02: of our lives these days and if so why? Yeah I would say so I think they part of they think
[14:44] SPEAKER_02: all these also kind of been there. I think that we're seeing them be more visible as well. These days
[14:50] SPEAKER_02: there's definitely you know crime is up and it's one of those industries that's got an inverse
[14:55] SPEAKER_02: relationship with the economy right because the worse it is out there the more we see people getting
[15:03] SPEAKER_02: desperate petty crime rises that kind of thing so we see that increase in presence and I think
[15:10] SPEAKER_02: it's just been a general trend over the last couple decades is that it's no secret that police
[15:17] SPEAKER_02: resources are down we see less becobs on the street it's it's challenging to get financing and
[15:25] SPEAKER_02: money for those things from the government so businesses turn to private options and I think
[15:31] SPEAKER_02: that's why you're seeing an increase in security and retail theft is crazy you can see videos
[15:39] SPEAKER_02: online of people grabbing arm loads of parkas and walking out the front door so I think
[15:45] SPEAKER_02: oftentimes when you look at how many staff it takes to run a shop or a bigger store or a sporting
[15:52] SPEAKER_02: good store letting one more position that's only responsibility is lost prevention seems like
[15:59] SPEAKER_02: I think a bit of a loahing fruit for retailers these days. What do you like about being an entrepreneur?
[16:07] SPEAKER_02: Great question I mean the easy answer is the freedom but it's that comes with that a high cost for
[16:12] SPEAKER_02: sure I like the people my honestly I've always enjoyed the people I've always I like meeting people
[16:20] SPEAKER_02: I like talking to people I like hearing people stories and so the opportunity to to build teams
[16:26] SPEAKER_02: and to and to meet people and to accomplish things together I just it's just fun and it's interesting
[16:34] SPEAKER_02: and and you know overcoming obstacles with people you've known for a long time or have just met
[16:42] SPEAKER_02: are both you know equally exciting opportunities so I love the people the most and the freedom to
[16:48] SPEAKER_02: get to meet people talk to people and learn from people is the best when you first started out what
[16:54] SPEAKER_01: was your biggest challenge you would say in starting up a business?
[17:01] SPEAKER_02: Gosh back then it would have been just resources I think to my first year and maybe maybe we did
[17:09] SPEAKER_02: 35,000 health nursing revenue in the first year right and wages were very different back then
[17:16] SPEAKER_02: in 2004 and and so it was hard we I think for me I always had a high standard and I always was
[17:24] SPEAKER_02: interested in delivering a high level product so just buying uniforms back then was very difficult
[17:31] SPEAKER_02: as as you know someone in his 20s just at a school there was no independent financing at the time
[17:39] SPEAKER_02: to go and buy inventory and uniforms and radios and all all those things that cost money so I think that
[17:46] SPEAKER_02: was the hardest part I think that closing the business was kind of the fun part because it was in
[17:52] SPEAKER_02: a space that we were really active in and interestingly that was the easy part.
[17:57] SPEAKER_01: You know running a business and baked in Calgary what would you say the benefits are of of being
[18:06] SPEAKER_01: a business owner in Calgary and and the broader sense in Alberta in this province?
[18:13] SPEAKER_02: I think the community in Calgary is incredible and I think that if that's the one thing that I wish
[18:20] SPEAKER_02: I had been engaged with earlier was the business community and you know I think it's remarkable
[18:27] SPEAKER_02: the number of entrepreneurs that exist in Alberta and I think what's even more interesting is
[18:33] SPEAKER_02: is the number of them that I have met that are true startup from nothing entrepreneurs and so
[18:40] SPEAKER_02: I think the the grit and the storytelling and and the support network in Alberta is really
[18:47] SPEAKER_02: outstanding and it's been a big part of our business especially for the last decade.
[18:54] SPEAKER_02: You know on top of that I think in general it's just it's a nice place to live that people are good
[19:03] SPEAKER_02: right and I think that the cost of living is such that you can find great talent here
[19:12] SPEAKER_02: and it's just it's been a meaningful and fun place to grow a business and it's been rewarding to be
[19:20] SPEAKER_02: in this province and in this city it's a great place to be. When you look at your your journey as
[19:29] SPEAKER_01: entrepreneur do you have any mentors along the way or any
[19:36] SPEAKER_01: ox or people that you you know have successful entrepreneurs that you looked up to and learn from?
[19:44] SPEAKER_02: Yeah I think along the way of you know could I name anyone on one mentor? No I've had
[19:51] SPEAKER_02: had lots along the way some of the entrepreneurs and some not a lot of my early influence was
[19:56] SPEAKER_02: a thought of seeing the entertainment business. The the guy that runs McEwen Hall his name is
[20:03] SPEAKER_02: Greg Curtis he's very well known in the entertainment business and we often joke that a lot of us
[20:09] SPEAKER_02: that that grew up in the concert production space spent some time with the school at Greg Curtis
[20:13] SPEAKER_02: and then Greg was great because and is great because he's always been so focused on people and the
[20:19] SPEAKER_02: customer experience and relationships and I think I learned that I was lucky to learn that from him
[20:25] SPEAKER_02: and and the others around him that the importance of treating people with respect and honoring
[20:32] SPEAKER_02: relationships you know there was another producer a guy named Dave Fortune lives in Vancouver that
[20:39] SPEAKER_02: said to me when I was a young volunteer in that space at one of the work tours a long time ago he
[20:45] SPEAKER_02: said you know never forget who were all of us on the ground are right because the people paying
[20:51] SPEAKER_02: the bills and the entities that employ us will come and go but we will all be here in some combination
[20:58] SPEAKER_02: you know 20 years from now so make sure you respect people and you treat people well and treat
[21:03] SPEAKER_02: your team well and not always stuck with me and so you know those those two guys in particular in
[21:08] SPEAKER_02: in the in the early years had a lot of influence with how I honored relationships and the
[21:14] SPEAKER_02: importance of relationships and I would say that's probably our key strength these days as far as
[21:19] SPEAKER_02: books to the come to mind mandatory business reading is from good to great like Jim Collins and
[21:28] SPEAKER_02: unreasonable hospitality oh my god I'm spacing on on his name but 11 Madison Park
[21:40] SPEAKER_02: unreasonable hospitality it will come to me okay that's such a good book
[21:45] SPEAKER_01: what what what what was it about those two bucks that that's that struck a chord with you I think
[21:51] SPEAKER_02: from good to great the the principle of you know a business being a bus and you have a limited you
[21:58] SPEAKER_02: know number of seats and you got to have the right people in the right seats to get to where you're
[22:02] SPEAKER_02: going was fundamentally you know very important and also I found that book just so interesting in
[22:10] SPEAKER_02: the way that it was very analytical that it took a subset of companies that were doing pretty good
[22:15] SPEAKER_02: that all of a sudden we're doing really well like great and analyzed what those commonalities
[22:21] SPEAKER_02: between them were and and it's just a very data driven fact-based book that looked at common
[22:28] SPEAKER_02: you know dominators across ultra successful companies so I think it's it's just a great book to
[22:35] SPEAKER_02: try and get an understanding of the different component components that make up a business
[22:40] SPEAKER_02: and then unreasonable hospitality is is the story of building 11 Madison Park which was a
[22:49] SPEAKER_02: you know kind of a fledgling fine dining restaurant in New York to become the best restaurant in the
[22:55] SPEAKER_02: world believe in 2017 and the story is completely centered around these fantastic customer experience
[23:04] SPEAKER_02: ideas that they had that that helped drive them to get there so there's there's a lot of
[23:11] SPEAKER_02: homage paid to a lot of the stories in that book and the popular show the bear on on effects and so
[23:19] SPEAKER_02: it's just that if you're in the if you're in a customer facing space of any kind it's just
[23:25] SPEAKER_02: can't recommend that book enough it really defines you know you know overall the concept of
[23:32] SPEAKER_01: surprise and delight hmm interesting so obviously being not to pruneer and in any business is almost
[23:40] SPEAKER_01: like a 24-7 adventure just curious how do you relax on what kind of interest do you have outside of work
[23:49] SPEAKER_02: well in my family my wife Beth and my kids Naurin Aiden they keep me you know entertained and busy
[23:56] SPEAKER_02: and love hanging out with them obviously any any chance I get recreationally I love to ski I joined
[24:06] SPEAKER_02: the Canadian ski patrol is a volunteer a few years ago so I tried to get out and do that as much as
[24:10] SPEAKER_02: they can I love that I love I love to hike I love to backcountry camp with the kids I love to
[24:16] SPEAKER_02: mountain bike I like to golf I like being active so anytime I anytime I can be outdoors even if
[24:23] SPEAKER_01: it's in the garden I'm outdoors and actually I think it was one thing that a lot of entrepreneurs
[24:29] SPEAKER_01: forget right and is that aspect because if you don't have that balance you're going to burn out
[24:35] SPEAKER_02: right absolutely and you know one one thing that I like about you know the the fundamental business
[24:43] SPEAKER_02: operating system we use that the company is it compels us to take what they call clarity breaks
[24:49] SPEAKER_02: and just the importance of a day or a half day for just complete disconnection and just
[24:58] SPEAKER_02: thoughts and being alone in thoughts so we really try to do that with our management team and our
[25:03] SPEAKER_02: and our leadership team here is is facilitating and encourage everybody to
[25:08] SPEAKER_02: at that time whether it's outdoors or on your back patio or whatever but yeah it's so important
[25:15] SPEAKER_01: gotta gotta get that clarity all right thanks so much Chris for joining us today
[25:21] SPEAKER_01: thanks so much for having me it was fun all right that was Chris Kerr who is president and founder
[25:26] SPEAKER_01: of xay security in Calgary I'm Mario Toniguzi managing editor of Canada's entrepreneur thanks for
[25:33] SPEAKER_01: joining us today
